Gaming World Forums
General Category => Entertainment and Media => Topic started by: pinkfluffy_dragon on June 07, 2007, 12:48:14 pm
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When watching Great Teacher Onizuka's first series in Japanese with subtitles.. I thought I'd watch the second in American.
It might just be me, but does anyone else feel that the American versions on anime completely lose the emphasis and feeling that the Japanese put into the characters.
It may just be because I watched the original first, but it just seemed really dull in comparison.
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American? Its called ENGLISH :rolleyes:
But yeah, dubs are generally horrible to watch on animes IMO.
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when i was more hardcore into anime i would have agreed, but now i cant be bothered to watch subtitles.
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subs > dubs, unless the actors are really good aka Nadesco (at least i thought) and even then most times Subs > dubs.
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dubs sux
i guess most dubbing companies like 4kids actually make it "for kids" god im witty
i hate amerika
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It's ENGLISH.
ENGLISH
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It is very rare that a dub is so bad that it changes the overall quality of the show in question. Most of the time when people make this outcry against the dubs, it's because they don't realize that the thing sounds every bit as silly in Japanese. I could understand the complaint ten years ago, when dubs generally were pretty awful.
But these days the biggest complaints people have is that they don't like the way a character's catch phrase/signature sentence construction got translated to english ("Believe it!"), or that a pun (that wouldn't have gotten in the first place if it weren't for a note from the translators) isn't translated well. Or maybe they just don't like the english interpretation of Kansai-ben. I mean there are occasional exceptions, like One Piece (I'm told), but they're mostly all titles translated by specific companies, so you know what to watch out for.
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. . . Most of the time when people make this outcry against the dubs, it's because they don't realize that the thing sounds every bit as silly in Japanese. I could understand the complaint ten years ago, when dubs generally were pretty awful.
Hi, if they don't realize that it sounds silly in Japanese then either it
a) does not sound that silly or it
b) doesn't even matter if it does sound silly because it doesn't sound that silly to them
Reasons why dubs are inferior:
Japanese culture is not English-speaking culture so translating the exact meaning becomes difficult
Dub-writers write their scripts in a particular way to sync up with the characters' mouth movements
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I don't know, I prefer to watch my anime in Canadian.
Gomu gomu no pistol, eh?
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Japanese culture is not English-speaking culture so translating the exact meaning becomes difficult
Dub-writers write their scripts in a particular way to sync up with the characters' mouth movements
Not really. See, that's exactly the issue--a translation that's faithful to the spirit of the original is generally held by everyone (except anime fans) to be the best kind of translation. The characters behave the same and the same sort of feeling is evoked by their actions and dialogue.
Now anime fans who seem to insist that subs are always better also seem to be the ones that think that translations are only acceptable when they're exact translations, which is idiotic. Look at FLCL's dub. Not only does it have great voice actors, but they manage to translate many of the Japanese cultural references to ones that mean about the same thing in English-speaking territories, (Or at least America. I have no idea if Britain ever got Crystal Pepsi or the Van Halen commercials associated with it), but it's far from an exact translation.
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I like how you use the exception instead of the rule in your arguments. FLCL is pretty average.
Not really. See, that's exactly the issue--a translation that's faithful to the spirit of the original is generally held by everyone (except anime fans) to be the best kind of translation. The characters behave the same and the same sort of feeling is evoked by their actions and dialogue.
I agree with this, but it just normally does not happen.
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You want to know a damn good dub? Wolf's Rain. Holy shit, did they ever do a bang up job on that.
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I can't really enjoy neither because english dubs are usually bad/awkward but then again the japanese female voices are extremely annoying and they all sound the same. imo.
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Okay before even more people have a dig! I know it is English, I am not retarded! :mad:
But the dubbing is done by American actors! Therefore you can hardly CALL it English just because the basic language is the same!
Us English speak and pronounce things differently to Americans! Hence me not saying it was an English dub! ffs! -_-
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You guys forgot that one little detail that the dubs are done by professional translators while subs are made by the amateur japanese speaker fans of the show.
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Okay before even more people have a dig! I know it is English, I am not retarded! :mad:
But the dubbing is done by American actors! Therefore you can hardly CALL it English just because the basic language is the same!
Us English speak and pronounce things differently to Americans! Hence me not saying it was an English dub! ffs! -_-
Ah, it's all in fun.. This is GW, after all.
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You guys forgot that one little detail that the dubs are done by professional translators while subs are made by the amateur japanese speaker fans of the show.
You know there are professional subs too, right?
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They're about the same, not counting exceptionally bad dubs.
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I suppose I am just a RIGID CONSERVATIVE since I have difficulties watching anything in any other language than the one that I was first exposed to in. Ie. Disney movies I can't stand to watch in English since I've seen them all in Finnish before, and in similar vein I just can't watch anime in spoken English either.
I always watch my anime with English subtitles as well even if there are Finnish ones available so you see just how deep my condition runs!
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I dunno why all you commies are complaining, but I speak American with a Texas dialect.
Anyways, I do usually prefer English subs, especially when the story itself is set in Japan, which is often the case with anime. In the rare cases the characters are meant to speak English but it's in Japanese I sometimes prefer dubs.
Given the nature of which I attain most of my media I usually get used to the Japanese voices and can never stand the English ones, but sometimes I much rather have English dubs. FLCL and El Hazard for instance... I think the VAs did such good jobs on those series that I can't think of seeing them without English voices.
As for games I enjoy games like the Metal Gear Solid series in English because it's *supposed* to be English... the Japanese voices in place just don't sit well with me no matter how good they are.
Plus David Hayter kicks ass.
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As for games I enjoy games like the Metal Gear Solid series in English because it's *supposed* to be English... the Japanese voices in place just don't sit well with me no matter how good they are.
Plus David Hayter kicks ass.
Russian's totally speak Russian in the U.S.S.R.
The Metal Gear series has always had excellent voice acting. There are tons of great American voice actors.
Okay before even more people have a dig! I know it is English, I am not retarded! :mad:
But the dubbing is done by American actors! Therefore you can hardly CALL it English just because the basic language is the same!
Us English speak and pronounce things differently to Americans! Hence me not saying it was an English dub! ffs! -_-
There are more American's who speak English than the English who speak english. Majority wins.
Seriously speaking, just because you English speak and pronounce things differently than Americans doesn't mean that it's not in English. That's like saying speaking Spanish in Mexico should be called Mexican and Spanish in Columbia should be called Columbian because of some minor differences in execution.
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When watching Great Teacher Onizuka's first series in Japanese with subtitles.. I thought I'd watch the second in American.
It might just be me, but does anyone else feel that the American versions on anime completely lose the emphasis and feeling that the Japanese put into the characters.
It may just be because I watched the original first, but it just seemed really dull in comparison.
Usually this is the case, but from time to time I've seen exceptional dubs.
(Mostly in games, though... Refer to Tales of the Abyss and FF12)
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Seriously speaking, just because you English speak and pronounce things differently than Americans doesn't mean that it's not in English. That's like saying speaking Spanish in Mexico should be called Mexican and Spanish in Columbia should be called Columbian because of some minor differences in execution.
That happens, though. It's not uncommon at all for people to refer to the dialect of whatever language they speak as the language. As an example I speak mostly the Mexican version of Spanish, and would have a lot of trouble speaking or understanding Castillian, and don't even ask me about Extremaduran. I've studied formal Japanese, but I would have a lot of trouble understanding Osakan. People who speak Mandarin don't always speak Cantonese. And heck, if you think knowing english means you can understand anyone who speaks native english, try talking to someone with a thick rural Irish brogue! Ever see Snatch?
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People who speak Mandarin don't always speak Cantonese.
What does that have to do with anything? Cantonese is a totally different language than Mandarin.
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They are both occasionally considered dialects of spoken Chinese. The fact that they're so different from one another only reinforces my point about dialects being totally different from one another even when considered to have descended from the same parent language.
I mean if you get right down to it, there was a time when the Romance Languages would be considered Latin dialects, and English would be considered a German dialect. Different languages are just different dialects plus time.
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That happens, though. It's not uncommon at all for people to refer to the dialect of whatever language they speak as the language. As an example I speak mostly the Mexican version of Spanish, and would have a lot of trouble speaking or understanding Castillian, and don't even ask me about Extremaduran. I've studied formal Japanese, but I would have a lot of trouble understanding Osakan. People who speak Mandarin don't always speak Cantonese. And heck, if you think knowing english means you can understand anyone who speaks native english, try talking to someone with a thick rural Irish brogue! Ever see Snatch?
Only Castillian is not a territory difference... It's actually a different dialect.
"american" and "english" are not different dialects.
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Austrian
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"american" and "english" are not different dialects.
Fine, "Super-dialects," then. Surely you admit that the various American English dialects are closer to one another than they are to the various British English or Australian English dialects. I mean a person speaking Received Pronounciation is more likely to understand someone using Cockney English than someone speaking United States Southern English would be. And someone speaking United States Southern English is way more likely to understand Cajun than someone speaking Welsh English would be.
Also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_English vs. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_English
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Not to bust in on the Great Dub Debate, but I've always felt that Cowboy Bebop had great dubs. Is that statement more or less correct?
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Not to bust in on the Great Dub Debate, but I've always felt that Cowboy Bebop had great dubs. Is that statement more or less correct?
Yeah. The actors behind it were great....the only problem with them, actually, is that they're good enough that people hire them for everything, and they don't really make any efforts to disguise their voices in other roles. So even though they're great performances, I still hear Spike when I'm listening to Roger Smith or that burned villain from Kenshin.
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At the risk of sounding offensive (well actually not really) - well like, for American cartoons I think it's common practice to hire white actors to play white people, Asians to play Asians and black people to play black people, right? Obviously it's a whole different situation in Japan, so I don't think it's weird for us to find it more natural for series with non-Asian people, or where the general population would speak English, to be dubbed in English. In the same way it's probably pretty convincing over in Japan when Japanese people try to play non-Japanese parts, but it doesn't seem right over here because we know what person of x nationality sounds like, in general.
But on the other hand, all those old kung-fu movies don't seem natural when they're dubbed, even if the actors are Chinese/Japanese/whatever. Because there's no reason they'd just happen to be speaking English/etc.
I was wondering if there are parts of Europe where you it's hard to find some random ethnic type, unlike in the US, so when the dub calls for it (let's say, a Russian dub of Afro Samurai), do they ever have to fake it?
By the way, hiring random celebrities as VAs is not the answer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Bih4x51zRA
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I will say this. If I see EVEN ONE episode of dragonball/z in its Japanese glory, I WILL FUCKEN KILL SOMEONE!!!!!!! I don't know what you're saying, but I'd rather watch a dubbed anime, or not watch it at all, eg Naruto, which I've never seen a single episode of because there is no MFing english version.
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I will say this. If I see EVEN ONE episode of dragonball/z in its Japanese glory, I WILL FUCKEN KILL SOMEONE!!!!!!! I don't know what you're saying, but I'd rather watch a dubbed anime, or not watch it at all, eg Naruto, which I've never seen a single episode of because there is no MFing english version.
O_o
Okay, first of all your post is somewhat hard to follow.
Secondly, what do you mean there's not an english version of Naruto? They televise the english version on Cartoon Network!
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I mean you know, the jap voices for DBZ. Its so high pitched and ALL of them sound as if they are being spoken by the same person. Not to mention the jap soundtrack/background music is shit. I don't know how people can dig that when you have a perfectly awesome english version. And Naruto, I try to torrent it, yet all I find is "non-english, subbed". Fuck that.
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I like to read the Bible in Hebrew with English subtitles.
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The reason why people tend to think the Japanese voice track is so much better... is because they aren't Japanese. It's harder for usto tell how good or bad it is when it is in a language we don't understand, so we assume it's better and more authentic. We see something as Japanese so we try and put Japanese voices too it, for association, this causes a problem whamerican characters who have a strange japanese dialect or a very thick japanese voice when speaking english. Most of us are guilty of it, it's nothing to feel bad about, both have their fair share of shitty VA's, some series get great dub VA's (Cowboy Bebop), likewise American cartoons such as the 90's Batman cartoon, or Beast Wars had great voice actors which really went well. But I can't really say is a series has great japanese voice actors as I'm not Japanese. It's an entirely different place, people speak and act differently over there, so how am I to know if it's good or bad when it all sounds like "GOJIRA TLANSFORMERU" to me?
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The reason why people tend to think the Japanese voice track is so much better... is because they aren't Japanese. It's harder for usto tell how good or bad it is when it is in a language we don't understand, so we assume it's better and more authentic. We see something as Japanese so we try and put Japanese voices too it, for association, this causes a problem whamerican characters who have a strange japanese dialect or a very thick japanese voice when speaking english. Most of us are guilty of it, it's nothing to feel bad about, both have their fair share of shitty VA's, some series get great dub VA's (Cowboy Bebop), likewise American cartoons such as the 90's Batman cartoon, or Beast Wars had great voice actors which really went well. But I can't really say is a series has great japanese voice actors as I'm not Japanese. It's an entirely different place, people speak and act differently over there, so how am I to know if it's good or bad when it all sounds like "GOJIRA TLANSFORMERU" to me?
This.
Also, I find dubs preferable because characters will actually have the accents that they're supposed to (ie, Irish person visiting Japan will actually sound Irish). Or at least, the accents are a lot easier to notice. The other thing is that most male villains sound a lot more convincing when they're voiced in English. I don't really know why that is but their voice usually sounds deeper and more powerful (if it's supposed to).
However, that being said, I still will watch, and enjoy, subtitled shows. City Hunter and Angel Heart being the main two.
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IMHO Japanese is better since I can feel the anime better O.O When I watched English Version (My very first was Vandread) I was... what the-?!?! I can't stay watching an anime in English dub, there's even one anime that's a soccer anime (Can't remember name...it's in the tip of my tongue...) that I watched in English and kinda suckered off and I switched to Japanese. But then it depends on the person...but truly, personally I like the Japanese Version (Specially for ff7: advent children O.O)
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The reason why people tend to think the Japanese voice track is so much better... is because they aren't Japanese. It's harder for usto tell how good or bad it is when it is in a language we don't understand, so we assume it's better and more authentic. We see something as Japanese so we try and put Japanese voices too it, for association, this causes a problem whamerican characters who have a strange japanese dialect or a very thick japanese voice when speaking english. Most of us are guilty of it, it's nothing to feel bad about, both have their fair share of shitty VA's, some series get great dub VA's (Cowboy Bebop), likewise American cartoons such as the 90's Batman cartoon, or Beast Wars had great voice actors which really went well. But I can't really say is a series has great japanese voice actors as I'm not Japanese. It's an entirely different place, people speak and act differently over there, so how am I to know if it's good or bad when it all sounds like "GOJIRA TLANSFORMERU" to me?
What? No. Usually it's the voice itself. Usually, english dubbers pick some really non-fitting voices and what is worse, alot of times they don't know how to act and the speech sounds very fucking false.
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I'm sorry, I forget that having AGENT JOHN SMITH with a heavy japanese accent is such a great fitting voice!
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What's really great is when they try to make the Japanese speak English, like in Black Lagoon or BECK. :rolleyes:
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I'm sorry, I forget that having AGENT JOHN SMITH with a heavy japanese accent is such a great fitting voice!
WHAT.ARE.YOU.TALKING.ABOUT
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IMHO Japanese is better since I can feel the anime better O.O When I watched English Version (My very first was Vandread) I was... what the-?!?! I can't stay watching an anime in English dub, there's even one anime that's a soccer anime (Can't remember name...it's in the tip of my tongue...) that I watched in English and kinda suckered off and I switched to Japanese. But then it depends on the person...but truly, personally I like the Japanese Version (Specially for ff7: advent children O.O)
You can feel anime?
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You can feel anime?
Wow, the amounts of japfag in that post truly are :ssj:
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You can feel anime?
Yes you can anime is a matter of story telling and such.
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WHAT.ARE.YOU.TALKING.ABOUT
Inappropriate casting in the japanese voice track :/ (it isn't exclusive to america you know <_<)
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i must watch all my animes with subtitles. i can't stand the english voices trying to match the emotions of the characters. most the time id rather hear the original actors with horrible engrish than joe blow off-the-street (or mary jane im-that-one-whiny-girl-voice-in-every-other-english-dub) add to that they often change the dialogue and sometimes add censorship, its really just a butchery of what is already perfectly done. i hate to think there are any people would sacrifice the original dialogue and voices for characters just to be so lazy as to not read subtitles, but some do :(
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i must watch all my animes with subtitles. i can't stand the english voices trying to match the emotions of the characters. most the time id rather hear the original actors with horrible engrish than joe blow off-the-street (or mary jane im-that-one-whiny-girl-voice-in-every-other-english-dub) add to that they often change the dialogue and sometimes add censorship, its really just a butchery of what is already perfectly done. i hate to think there are any people would sacrifice the original dialogue and voices for characters just to be so lazy as to not read subtitles, but some do :(
Wow. What's it like back there in 1995? Have they started showing Animaniacs yet?
This just flat out isn't true anymore, except maybe for 4Kids translations.
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I remember watching one episode of Last Exile in english and it didn't bother me THAT much, I prefer subtitles though.
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Depends on the anime. Dragonball Z, for example, I'd much rather the Funimation dubs, rather than the original Japanese subbed episodes, only because I'm not that fond of any of the Japanese voices in DBZ. When it comes to other things like Bleach, I don't really find a difference between dubbed and subbed episodes.
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Yeah, depends on the anime (and sometimes the company). For instance, FLCL has some puns that only make sense in Japanese, and the people who subtitle it are kind enough to add explanations to it. And sometimes the voice actors are just more interesting. On the other hand, I do applaud many companies for their excellent dubs on a myriad of series. Honestly, I used to be anti-Funimation until I realized that they actually did a good job with Fullmetal Alchemist. Now they're doing pretty well, I'd say.
In the same way, Japanese companies are hit and miss, too. I can sort of agree with whoever said that it's because we don't understand Japanese that makes the language appealing, but, hey, there are some times when a bad voice is just... bad, no matter what language it's in. Subs are more convenient when you're watching a show airing in Japan, though.
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You lose allot of story when a manga is animated, then a little more when the anime is re-dubbed.
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Wow. What's it like back there in 1995? Have they started showing Animaniacs yet?
This just flat out isn't true anymore, except maybe for 4Kids translations.
fan of dubbing, eh? and 4 kids gets a "MAYBE"??? this is why they can keep putting these horrible versions of the animes on, cause people will still watch them and think any sort of subtitling is "ancient technology". and if you think '95 is the cutoff date for bad dubs you are sorely mistaken.
and what part did you think was not true? They still cant capture the emotion right, they still use recycled english voice actors, and dubbed over anime is still getting censored and having its lines/dialogue changed.
in japan, the voices for the anime chars are chosen to best fit the characters in the story. And their voice acting in the booth is monitored and directed by people actually involved with making the movie. Not some non-related studio with very little if ANY input/guidance from the actual creation team.
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fan of dubbing, eh? and 4 kids gets a "MAYBE"??? this is why they can keep putting these horrible versions of the animes on, cause people will still watch them and think any sort of subtitling is "ancient technology". and if you think '95 is the cutoff date for bad dubs you are sorely mistaken.
4Kids gets a maybe because I'm not convinced the shows they get weren't terrible before they got ahold of them, not because I think their dubs are acceptable. I mean sure, fans of the show assure me they're great....but everything I've seen suggests that they were pretty awful from the start. I haven't seen Tokyo Mew Mew (dubbed OR subbed), but I know that Pokemon, YuGiOh, Shaman King and One Piece all seem to have much deeper problems than the voice acting and what their weapons look like.
and what part did you think was not true? They still cant capture the emotion right, they still use recycled english voice actors, and dubbed over anime is still getting censored and having its lines/dialogue changed.
No, you see, those are just things that fans of stupid anime say so that they get to feel like it was the dub that made their favorite show seem stupid, when really the only reason they didn't think it was stupid in Japanese was that they didn't understand what was going on. And the Japanese studios also reuse voice actor after voice actor, too--look at Megumi Hayashibara or Kotono Mitsuishi's filmographies! And most of them are definitely from the Wendee Lee and Steven Blum/David Lucas school of voice acting ("use my regular voice for everything") rather than the Mel Blanc or (to use a more modern example) Tara Strong school of voice acting ("actually try and succeed at making different characters have a unique voice").
And yeah, lines get changed. But they get changed to make them fit english better. For example, people complain about Naruto's stupid little "Believe it!" all the time....but it's pretty much exactly as annoying as his stupid "-ttebayo!" thing was in Japanese, and gets across the same idea. But the fans complain because it makes them realize how silly what they're watching was to begin with. Again, 4Kids is an exception, but most companies translating anime now get the lines fairly right unless they're having to fix issues with pop culture references. But I don't see it as a butchering to change a reference to Pocari Sweat into a reference to Crystal Pepsi, since no one in America knows what Pocari Sweat is. Or if they do, they're probably super nerds, and super nerds complain about everything anyway.
in japan, the voices for the anime chars are chosen to best fit the characters in the story. And their voice acting in the booth is monitored and directed by people actually involved with making the movie. Not some non-related studio with very little if ANY input/guidance from the actual creation team.
In Japan, mostly, voices are chosen based on how much it will cost to get them to work, and whether or not they're available. How they fit the character is a consideration, but not a whole lot more than in America. The main difference between the industries in the two countries is that there's a lot more cross-pollination in Japan, so that most singers and actors are willing to do voice acting gigs. Other than that, it's pretty much the same.
Yeah, like I said before: most of these arguments sound like they're coming from people who got disgusted by the way things were handled in 1995 and decided to hate dubs forever without ever listening to them again. Add that with the natural tendency for anime fans to want to like things better in Japanese (since you get to tell people "I watched it in the original Japanese," which impresses people, except not really), and you get this whole subculture of "purists" that just make it all seem so silly.
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Heh, it always comes as a culture shock to me when going abroad to see just how much is dubbed. Cartoons I can understand, but even movies and TV series? You really want to try and deliver good lipsync for real people with recycled voice actors just for convenience and eliminate the possibility to learn a new language at the same time? Well, to each his own, but when you come from a country where 99% of all moving pictures come subbed it seems like such a pointless waste of money and effort for a dubious gain. It's understandable for children's shows though, since the target demographic does not necessarily possess the required fast reading skills, and since it appears most channels order anime for their Saturday morning cartoon spots it's probably the inevitable outcome. (Though at least back when I was a kid looks like the Finnish TV authorities thought that first graders at primary school could take subbed M.I.B. no prob.)
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Uh... French dubs are bad too :) , the rythmic is not the same, it's normal !! Japanese is an oriental language :cool:
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I just don't understand how people can say that the authentic Japanese is better when they clearly can't understand what they are saying in the first place, it's just phonetic jargon when it enters your eardrums, how could that constitute for superiority.
The fact of the matter is this, subs can translate 100% literally because they don't have to deal with syncing with the talking animation, in the meanwhile dubs have to consider that they have to translate and sync up with the animation. The Japanese language usually has a lot more words within a sentence and when translated into English it could only be 2-3 words, so of course they have to fill those extra frames with extra words.
As for whats better it really depends, people who have SEEN the cartoon first as a fansub will be used to the voice and when a few months later when it hits state-side it will feel foreign to them because they have the character's voices already in their heads and what they should sound like.
What matters is how you watch the cartoon initially, weather you start with English or Japanese, other than that you really can't say one is better than the other unless you can understand Japanese, because honestly, there are some pretty terribly voice acted Japanese cartoons that sounds better in English (eg. Cowboy Beebop).
Shit I prefer in Japanese: Japanese themed shows like Rurouni Kenshin, Yakitate Japan, anything that has to deal with japanese culture I prefer to watch in it's native form
Shit I prefer in English: ANY Japanese Cartoon that has a western setting, why? because it just feels wierd having a middle eastern kid talking in japanese the whole time like in Gundam 00, that's actually one of my beefs with Gundam, and other western themed shows. It just doesn't suit well when you watch it in Japanese because it just doesn't. Shows like Full Metal Alchemist I prefer in English as well...
Edowarudo!!!!!!! (Edward)
ARU!!!!!!! (Al)
wtf.
English names should be said in English thats just how it is. I mean I can understand that it's like that in japanese because thats their language. But when I watch it, seeing as I know English I would rather watch that show in the language where the theme is set.
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for me it depends on the show. I am american and I dont speak japanese. but some shows I prefer subbed. the dub of Love hina is bad. same with now and then here and there. and Lain. I know these are older animes. but the voice acting seems so much better in japanese. only new dub i've seen is Tales of Earthsea. which I thought was well done. and have to say I prefer the dub releases of Ghibli movies. and I guess it had to do with the quality. since they are released by disney you would expect professional voice acting and a quality dub.
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Why would you ever want it dubbed to english? That just makes anime even more corny.
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heh...
*points to siggy*
keep the change.
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I prefer the Japanese versions because the American versions are usually censored in some way, shape, or form.
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Bump.
For me it depends on what I saw first. I saw DBZ on TV in english during my childhood, so I can't stand the japanese version. Same with Yu-Gi-Oh!. But animes I started watching later, like Elfen Lied, Death Note, Naruto, Bleach, Chrono Crusade, Flame of Recca, etc. I saw all those in japanese so I can't stand the other versions.
In general though, I have to say japanese is better then english. It just puts more feeling into the whole thing.
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likely should warn you for bumping or something, but this forum is so dead that I'm allowing you to twitch it;s corpse.
Also I am finding it hard to watch japanese language tracks these days due to every male character sounding like they're a college student whose just finished running a marathon (and are thus very out of breath and gasping at everything) and every female trying to do dolphin impressions with their high pitched sqealing voices.
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Hehe, you seen Death Note? Lots of voice variation in there. Try it out ;)
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I've seen deathnote(sums up all that's been wrong with anime the past like 10 years)
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Death Note fucking sucks. I still remember how they spent a small country's GDP on animation each time Light wrote something on that fucking deathnote...
Also, to stay in tone to the bump... Just like I don't like my hollywood movies dubbed to spanish, I like my anime in japanese.
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Most anime I've seen sound equally bad in both languages, so I have no preference, except for really bad animes, in which case I feel less gay when the people around me can't hear how shitty the dialogue is.
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Japanese seems to be the better option by far,
Although when I started to voice act myself and appreciate the art, English voice acting sounds a LOT better.
Nothing can replace the original dubbing, though. It has nothing to do with Japanese > American. It's easily noticable if you watch Braveheart in French or Spanish.
The original will be the better one, although the art of voice acting makes everything much more interesting.
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Japanese voices simply because I've gotten used to watching anime before it got translated.
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For the most part I don't really give a shit. As long as the translation isn't wrong, it doesn't affect my viewing of a show. That said, if I have the choice, I'd usually take the subbed version. Because, you know... I speak English and all.
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btw anybody who thinks subs > dubs... remember how "nostalgic" the start of naruto2 was?
yeah.
I just owned you all.
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btw anybody who thinks subs > dubs... remember how "nostalgic" the start of naruto2 was?
yeah.
I just owned you all.
It's better then to hear "blalbalbblabla BELIEVE ITTT!!!!" all the time...
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I'm such a subtitle supporter, I can't even think of one instance where dubbing did AS good a job as the original voices, none the less BETTER. Usually someone would reply to me with "but what about X on cartoon network", to which I say "exactly". IMO, if you prefer the dub, you either never saw the subtitled version, never learned to read fast, or you're the kind of person who likes to have people read to you instead of reading for yourself, even if they do their own voices for each character, change the lines around, and drop some of the lines altogether. Japanese is the language that the series/show was designed for, and the voice actors, emotions, and even pronunciation was very carefully considered. It wasn't just ideas thrown around like "hey, what if we give this guy a southern accent for no apparent reason", or worse, having that reason be for "westernization". Dubbing should sound like they're translating everything word-for-word as loyally as possible, not like they're trying to make it better than the original.
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I'd rather watch fan-subbed or subbed anime (or even Korean TV series, Chinese TV series, Tokusatsus) than watching English-dubbed ones, 'cuz of censorship, mismatched and unsynched voices and more shit expected from america!
EX. from Chou Sei Shin Gransazers (Cartoon Network dub)
The doctor (Wind Tribe) was supposed to be at 20's but it's American voice was at 30's!
In Gundam SEED, had anyone seen what some fans call "disco guns" when people were shooting (not in their robots)?
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I just don't understand how people can say that the authentic Japanese is better when they clearly can't understand what they are saying in the first place, it's just phonetic jargon when it enters your eardrums, how could that constitute for superiority.
The fact of the matter is this, subs can translate 100% literally because they don't have to deal with syncing with the talking animation, in the meanwhile dubs have to consider that they have to translate and sync up with the animation. The Japanese language usually has a lot more words within a sentence and when translated into English it could only be 2-3 words, so of course they have to fill those extra frames with extra words.
As for whats better it really depends, people who have SEEN the cartoon first as a fansub will be used to the voice and when a few months later when it hits state-side it will feel foreign to them because they have the character's voices already in their heads and what they should sound like.
What matters is how you watch the cartoon initially, weather you start with English or Japanese, other than that you really can't say one is better than the other unless you can understand Japanese, because honestly, there are some pretty terribly voice acted Japanese cartoons that sounds better in English (eg. Cowboy Beebop).
English names should be said in English thats just how it is. I mean I can understand that it's like that in japanese because thats their language. But when I watch it, seeing as I know English I would rather watch that show in the language where the theme is set.
The reason why people tend to think the Japanese voice track is so much better... is because they aren't Japanese. It's harder for usto tell how good or bad it is when it is in a language we don't understand, so we assume it's better and more authentic. We see something as Japanese so we try and put Japanese voices too it, for association, this causes a problem whamerican characters who have a strange japanese dialect or a very thick japanese voice when speaking english. Most of us are guilty of it, it's nothing to feel bad about, both have their fair share of shitty VA's, some series get great dub VA's (Cowboy Bebop), likewise American cartoons such as the 90's Batman cartoon, or Beast Wars had great voice actors which really went well. But I can't really say is a series has great japanese voice actors as I'm not Japanese. It's an entirely different place, people speak and act differently over there, so how am I to know if it's good or bad when it all sounds like "GOJIRA TLANSFORMERU" to me?
Just quoting these because they have been the best answers in this entire thread.
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That's nice but we can all read and if you have nothing to add yourself maybe you shouldn't have posted
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btw anybody who thinks subs > dubs... remember how "nostalgic" the start of naruto2 was?
yeah.
I just owned you all.
No. No you didn't. The original OPs are ten times better than the english ones. All of them. Each and every. Single. One.
Some anime are alright dubbed - FMA for example. Didn't notice a detraction in Fruits Basket and most of the others I've bought are okay. The Bleach dubs are okay, but I hate that they change the name from shinigami to soul reaper. Guess that's what I get for reading the manga first. :sweat:
Others fail mightily. Hello there, One Piece. Yes. 4KIDS ruins good anime. One thing I have learnt.
Naruto. Oh gods! Poor Naruto, or, as the english version says Nuh-rooooot-oh. God. If you're gonna dub a series get the damn names right, people. I purposefully bought the whole series in Japanese just to avoid the horrid english dubs. Hello, Sa-kuuuura. :tsk:
One series I do not recommend the english version of is "Those who hunt elves". It's a bad anime in and of itself, but when you have a seven-ten year old kid with a deeper voice than his teenage brother... :fogetnah:
And that was my two cents.
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I'm with Kaworu's post from last year about how we don't understand the people and think it's authentic and all that jazz, but to me the japanese voice actors put more (ugh) feeling into how the character sounds. After watching dubbed, then subbed versions of the same anime. The subbed usually comes out on top. The English voice actors just sound like they're reading line after line in a studio by themselves trying to be voice whatever character they get as extreme as possible. By extreme I mean making characters sound overly badass and the characters end up sounding arrogant, etc. Maybe I just like hearing japanese women voice every character in the anime. :fogetnaughty:
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if a dub was good I would probably watch it, but I'm too invested in having spent the last how many years of my life watching subbed anime, and I'm so used to subtitles that I even prefer having subtitles to things that are in english (eg movies etc), so I don't know really. I'll always gravitate towards the original japanese if possible. I don't really have anything against dubs, although most of them are pretty horrible (although that isn't to say that some of the japanese voice actors aren't all that great, although granted if you can't understand the language you can't point out if a character has a terrible out of place accent like you can in dubs)
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Naruto always sounds like he's suffering from major constipation in the japanese voice track. I guess that's what happens when you only eat Ramen!
Japanese voice acting is generically (this doesn't apply to everything, but to most) severely exaggerated and over the top. I dunno maybe that's how people are in japan, but for me it's just like they try to hard and it ends up feeling more like a childrens show more than the dubbed version does.
I mean...
SUBS NOT DUBS!!!
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every female animu character is voiced by the same 9 year old boy.
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I think you have it backwards. Every nine year old anime boy is voiced by the same japanese female.
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Anime dubs, in my opinion, are actually pretty good these days, so I usually watch the dub. Some good ones being Cowboy Bebop, Outlaw Star, Yu Yu Hakusho (especially), Fruits Basket, Full Metal Alchemist, etc.
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Oh man, I forgot about Outlaw Star, I haven't seen that in years. I think it was one of the first anime I never missed an episode of until it got pulled from the station.
I think a good recent example of how bad dubs are is Gunslinger Girl. I love the show and have all the first season episodes in Japanese with English subtitles/English with no subtitles. And watching it it subbed, then switching to dubbed really makes me realize how bad the english voice acting was. I especially hated the way Triela and Rico sounded and the way they spoke.
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the english Cowboy Bebop is prettymuch one of the best examples of voice acting of anything.
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I would say that some of the better dubbing in English would be The Big O, Nadeisco, and Full Metal Panic. Especially that last one, because the voice actors seem to perfectly capture Chidori's and Sousuke's voices. That said, I usually find Japanese voice acting to sound better to me, though I welcome nice voices from either side of the sea.
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After seeing some HORRIBLE dubs back in the day I've decided to never watch a dub ever again (hopefully). Mostly it's also because I've started watching a series in japanese and then I find it really hard to switch from japanese to english. Actually I prefer that they use the original language no matter what kind of movies / series we're talking about so...
subs not dubs.....
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It really depends mostly on the anime, the characters, and the setting. KOLE is pretty much in the ball park on this one. Some animes sound better subbed, while others sound better dubbed...the main reason I can weigh that is because I speak and come from a mix of both English and Japanese...so...yeah...probably the best example of a situation where dubs were better was DBZ. The voices just fit better in the actiony situations. The characters just sounded more like their age really. I absolutely hated Goku's voice in Japanese *shudders*. If you watch Japanese GT, it's even worse, because he sounds the same before and after he becomes a child again...
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Japanese voice acting is generically (this doesn't apply to everything, but to most) severely exaggerated and over the top. I dunno maybe that's how people are in japan, but for me it's just like they try to hard and it ends up feeling more like a childrens show more than the dubbed version does.
This exactly. I don't get what you people mean by "more feeling." All the japanese voice acting I've heard is THE MOST HAMMY SHIT I'VE EVER HEARD.
Compare, voice acting:
with spoken word (i know she's american, but I can't find any real japanese naturally speaking)
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It all depends. First off, when it comes to the hammy stuff, just bear in mind that you're using One Piece as an example. Secondly, it all varies from situation to situation as far as that goes. Some of the Japanese Voice actors put in extra emphasis or "emotion", while some don't. Some American VAs sound more mature, while some don't...
Example where Jap>Eng:
Japanese
English
Only issue is the melodramatic dialogue...
Example where Eng>Jap
Comparisons of both...
The dialogue is a little different, but oh well...
These aren't the BEST examples, but they were the first that I could find offhand, and they make my point to an extent. Basically, Japanese VA tends to have more of a dramatic tone, while English VA tends to sound tougher, more gruff, manlier, etc.
Keep in mind these are just generalties, and are just general examples and several exceptions exist.