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General Category => General Talk => Topic started by: Fire Mage on June 18, 2008, 04:59:12 am

Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Fire Mage on June 18, 2008, 04:59:12 am
Click here to learn about what's allowed in your food! (http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/dalbook.html)

So apparently this is a "book" full of the level of stuff the Food and Drug Administration allows in the U.S. food supplies. Of course, it says averages of stuff is usually lower, but still...they allow up to the stuff listed here.

For example:

Code:[Select]
PEANUT BUTTER    Insect filth
                   (AOAC 968.35) Average of 30 or more insect fragments per 100 grams
                   Rodent filth
                   (AOAC 968.35) Average of 1 or more rodent hairs per 100 grams
                   Grit
                   (AOAC 968.35) Gritty taste and water insoluble inorganic residue is more than 25 mg per 100 grams

They allow what is there in peanut butter, saying it is a naturally occurring and impossible to rid all of it. Although it's not saying that all this is in every piece of peanut butter, you should get the point.


So, pretty interesting, and gross!

What do you think? And for people outside of the U.S., do you know of anything like this for your government, etc.?
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Dark Angel on June 18, 2008, 05:33:01 am
I think this is pretty implied when you have huge open factories that just squeeze this stuff into containers. It doesn't bother me.
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Doktormartini on June 18, 2008, 05:53:46 am
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: crone_lover720 on June 18, 2008, 06:07:47 am
mornin dok


topic: so??? did you think your food is 100% pure or what, i don't get why this is alarming. some of this shit (fecal matter for instance) is literally everywhere, you eat very small amounts of it every day. Even if the food was somehow entirely pure, you'd get lots of this stuff just from THE AIR as you're eating it

anecdote: supposedly a guy would pee in the apple cider VAT at our community fair every year. except it doesn't matter because it's a huge fucking vat
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: HL on June 18, 2008, 09:54:46 am
who cares this shouldn't really be a big surprise or scare to anyone. you're pretty crazy if you think anything you eat is 100% pure ever.
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Ghost_Aspergers on June 18, 2008, 09:57:55 am
You have to remember that there is no way to avoid it and that safe levels are still safe levels....

... and that this information is old news. If you are really disgusted by this, then stop looking it up (Hi Doktor). The world is a dirty... filthy place under a microscope, and these studies/ regulations can make anything sound horrifying when in reality everything is just fine.
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Apathy on June 18, 2008, 10:22:14 am
It's not surprising but at the same time it can still be a little off putting for some people. I'm guessing thats why they wrap up some fruit and veg in a hundred layers of plastic. We do not need it, but i guess we're all a little picky about what we eat these days. Saying that, rodent filth and grit is a selling point of peanut butter in my country, we're not too bothered, we have it written on the label.
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Lars on June 18, 2008, 10:46:26 am
extra proteins is never bad
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Vellfire on June 18, 2008, 11:13:01 am
Well alright then I guess I'll just not eat food anymore (seriously this is kind of expected if they didn't allow something like this we wouldn't have FOOD)
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Kaworu on June 18, 2008, 11:16:39 am
fuck this, I ain't eating no rat shit!
/me starts eating nettles

oh wait, dogs urinate on them...
shit I'll have to rely on oxygen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inedia)

but wait... smokers and cars and black people...
/me holds breath

nomatter how sterile things are, there will always be filth, it's actually better that way (because if it was totally sterile, we wouldn't be as immune so tiny shit coul really fuck us up)
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Artis Leon Ivey Jr on June 18, 2008, 02:41:28 pm
they had an episode of frasier about this that was amazing where niles managed to gross out an entire class of kids by talking about all the shit on their food he had memorized.
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Doktormartini on June 18, 2008, 04:53:55 pm
Quote from: Lars on June 18, 2008, 10:46:26 am
extra proteins is never bad
Actually too much is but it's not the place to talk about it lolz


I remember getting a little packet handout in gradeschool with some info like this on it.  It pretty much surprised everyone.  As I got older I then realized this stuff can't be avoided 100%
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Fire Mage on June 18, 2008, 06:00:13 pm
no no no i'm not saying OH SHIT THERE'S SHIT IN MY FOOD i gotta stop eating etc

i said it was gross but "interesting" i mean where the hell do they pull these numbers out and stuff too like "oh man 3 rat hairs that's one too many for chocolate" or whatever the hell

i know it's unavoidable and i'm not freaking out i was just posting it !!


p.s. doktormartini wtf never post an hour long video again no one will watch it
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: jamie on June 18, 2008, 07:51:59 pm
Quote
i said it was gross but "interesting" i mean where the hell do they pull these numbers out and stuff too like "oh man 3 rat hairs that's one too many for chocolate" or whatever the hell

well they will have some tests, experiments, calculations etc to determine at what point the risk of a food spreading disease and infection becomes unacceptable. i don't know how well the fda works, but i'm assuming it's a good organisation which does it's job judging by the replies so far.

so 3 rat hairs per 100 grams of chocolate for example might mean that there is potentially enough bacteria in 3 rat hairs for it to spread disease, but humans can tolerate the levels which would be on two or one.

i don't think the reasoning is like "three rat hairs? no way that's too gross", it will be more to do with science and numbers.

i'm not even modestly irked by this knowledge. i mean i might feel a little hesitant to eat something if someone could tell me if definitely had half an ounce of pigeon shit in it, but i don't have that dickhead over my shoulder all day long. it's just a slightly gross fact which is only a problem if you want it to be (or if you're a nutcase!)
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Doktormartini on June 18, 2008, 08:02:30 pm
Quote
i don't know how well the fda works, but i'm assuming it's a good organisation which does it's job judging by the replies so far.
It's not that good of an organization.  I'm not saying everything it does is bad...but it's had it's fair share of horrible things (Vioxx to name one).
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: jamie on June 18, 2008, 08:09:10 pm
yeah i thought you'd say something like that. if you want to post a couple of things they have done which are objectionable with some links showing evidence (that aren't 90 minute speech videos please) then i'd like to give em a skim.
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Doktormartini on June 18, 2008, 08:23:36 pm
Quote from: real_jamicus on June 18, 2008, 08:09:10 pm
yeah i thought you'd say something like that. if you want to post a couple of things they have done which are objectionable with some links showing evidence (that aren't 90 minute speech videos please) then i'd like to give em a skim.
Well they approved the drug vioxx even though it was dangerous and so many people who were on it got health problems related to it such as strokes.
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/vioxx_estimates.html

They approved artificial sweetners which are made in a lab.  Things like Splenda (which is made with chlorine fyi) which hasn't been significantly studied.

For example, some of the Aspartame you consumed is converted into Formeldahyde in your body. 
Quote
In Survey of Aspartame studies: correlation of outcome and funding sources, Ralph G. Walton, Professor of Clinical Psychiatry, Northeastern Ohio Universities College of Medicine (NEOUCOM) [90], surveyed 166 studies of aspartame in peer reviewed medical literature. According to Walton's review, 74 studies had Nutrasweet industry related funding and 92 were independently funded. 100% of the industry funded research attested to aspartame's safety, whereas 92% (85 of 92) of the independently funded research identified a problem.[91]
A lot of companies that fund things are funding research for THEIR product meaning they want money.  They're not going to say Aspartame is bad if that is what they are selling.  For example, Cardbury-Schweppes is known to invest money in diabetes research.

Gotta go to school I will edit this when I get home probably.
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Mince Wobley on June 18, 2008, 08:44:24 pm
Doktormartini is right, they aren't perfect.

When I grow up I want to make a "clean" food factory and I'll make 100% clean food (I'll use the same kind of room they make integrated circuits in) and sell it to rich people with mysophobia/OCD.
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: blood hell on June 18, 2008, 08:53:59 pm
there aint nothing wrong with splenda. the chlorine makes the body think its not sugar so it passes right though you. you'd have to eat like BAGS of it everyday to cause you harm. you get more chlorine in your system from jumping in a pool
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Grunthor on June 19, 2008, 05:28:28 am
Quote from: Tophue on June 18, 2008, 08:53:59 pm
You get more chlorine in your system from jumping in a pool

Or from drinking tap water in most cities. I swear the tap water at my parents house has the most freaking chlorinated water I've ever had the displeasure of drinking. 

 Anyways, I read something similar to this report years ago, but I figure if it's not going to kill me, then why worry about it.  I'm not sure how they come up with their numbers as to what's acceptable though.
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: `~congresman Ron paul~~ on June 19, 2008, 05:33:55 am
Quote from: real_jamicus on June 18, 2008, 07:51:59 pm
well they will have some tests, experiments, calculations etc to determine at what point the risk of a food spreading disease and infection becomes unacceptable. i don't know how well the fda works, but i'm assuming it's a good organisation which does it's job judging by the replies so far.

so 3 rat hairs per 100 grams of chocolate for example might mean that there is potentially enough bacteria in 3 rat hairs for it to spread disease, but humans can tolerate the levels which would be on two or one.

i don't think the reasoning is like "three rat hairs? no way that's too gross", it will be more to do with science and numbers.

I don't think it works this way since almost all the food is pasteurized or otherwise disinfected before it's put into shipping containers. I think the idea is probably that if a factory passes these conditions, the food it produces is likely very safe to eat, and if it fails these conditions, it has demonstrated poor hygienic conditions which means it may produce the occasional shipment that gets people sick.

for the alarmists, you're probably going to find tons more human skin flakes or hair or spittle and such or even industrial grease and oil than rat shit in a factory manned by workers, you know. it is still tons more clean than catching and eating food yourself (can you imagine what kind of shit goes into fresh-caught fish from a river or a recently slaughtered cow?)!

these statistics don't bother me either; the US has some of the cleanest food in the world (come on, can you imagine what the standards are in BELARUS or MONGOLIA or even CHINA) and besides, you probably get nearly as much filth as is regulated simply by eating food on a daily basis through silverware, your hands, and breathing in dust.
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Frisky SKeleton on June 19, 2008, 05:57:31 am
i wonder if they have peanut butter allowances in escargot
Title: Food and Drug Administration "Defect" Handbook
Post by: Doktormartini on June 19, 2008, 06:03:39 am
oh shit now my peanut butter is not vegan :( just kidding.