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General Category => Technology and Programming => Topic started by: Blitzen on July 20, 2008, 02:44:34 am

Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Blitzen on July 20, 2008, 02:44:34 am
I have this RAW file I got off the FUJIFILM front end at the photolab where I work. That being said, its not like any particularly normal camera-sensor RAW file. I've tried a bunch of programs and I couldn't get any of my programs (PS 7, GIMP, etc) to open it properly. Please help a neighbour out and see if you can read this file, and then if you do get it open tell me how I can do the same. I know CS2 and CS3 have better RAW support, so it might be readable in one of those, but so far its been pretty impossible to get this thing open. I have a back up plan once I get to work tomorrow, but the odds that it will work are not certain.

Get the file here -> http://www.megaupload.com/?d=WNH29A40

Here's what I know about this RAW format:
- Its compressed. JPG files of the same image are the same size, which probably means compression similar to JPG compression but encoded differently.
- Its FUJI specific. Never designed to be used in any other software than FUJI lab software, so chances are general RAW packages may not support this format.
- Its OLD. Probably 7-8 years old at least. Software that only reads the newest formats is likely not going to be able to open this.

I've got to do a batch conversion job on about 200 of these to JPG for a customer and it needs to be done by Monday, so if anyone could tell me how to get these open that would be swell.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Mama Luigi on July 20, 2008, 03:12:02 am
I loathe camera RAW files. They're just a waste of time. JPEG is standard, contains same amount of color/light information, smaller file size, doesn't require processing. Ugh.

I attempted to open it in CS3, and couldn't get a tangible image out of it.
EDIT: I tried another program called XnView and it came up with a similar image: lines of junk.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Blitzen on July 20, 2008, 03:18:20 am
Yeah, I usually shoot in JPG myself, but these files came out of the digital interface for the lab photo-printer (one of those big honkin' thing with the moving racks). I think that these actually had been converted from TIFs or JPGs (seeing as how they were once scanned in and probably needed to go through the TWAIN source) for export to the printer, but I don't know how to get them to convert back. I've planned a couple workarounds to try and trick the frontend software tomorrow to export them for burning as JPGs, but I really don't know if its going to work.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Chubby Skelly on July 20, 2008, 05:13:13 am
JPEG is for people too cheap to buy a decent-sized SD card.

Have you tried IrfanView (http://www.irfanview.com/) with the plugin pack (http://www.irfanview.com/plugins.htm)?
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Blitzen on July 20, 2008, 05:27:54 am
Even if I could open it with IrfanView, it doesn't have save or convert support for RAW files.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: goat on July 20, 2008, 05:37:57 am
You could just take a screenshot at that point.

Edit: do these help
http://www.dcresource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13854
http://www.geocities.co.jp/SiliconValley-PaloAlto/9919/s7raw.html
http://www.whisper-wood.co.uk/FujiRawConv.pdf
http://photo.net/digital-darkroom-forum/00MyJY
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Blitzen on July 20, 2008, 07:12:03 am
Thanks goat, but again, these raw files (while image files) aren't like normal camera sensor raw files, so support or programs that work with camera-specific raw formats aren't going to be much help.

With Irfanview, I couldn't get it to open properly. Even if I could I'm not willing to screencap 200 pics and then crop and convert them, I'd rather scan in the originals again (although that's also really something I'd like to avoid). I'm going to try my workarounds tomorrow, and I'll let you guys know how it goes.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: dom on July 20, 2008, 10:19:03 am
Quote from: Mama Luigi on July 20, 2008, 03:12:02 am
JPEG is standard, contains same amount of color/light information
hhahahhahahahahahhahahahaha
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: dom on July 20, 2008, 10:19:22 am
what i mean to say is no, not by far
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Alec on July 20, 2008, 11:04:41 am
yeah RAW is lossless, JPEG is not.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Blitzen on July 21, 2008, 02:50:54 am
I took care of it. Found a way to convert the files at work. Thanks for your efforts guys, consider this topic kaput.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Mama Luigi on July 21, 2008, 03:54:10 am
Quote from: Alec on July 20, 2008, 11:04:41 am
yeah RAW is lossless, JPEG is not.
Incorrect. Most cameras (all cameras?) - to my knowledge - save lossless jpegs.

Quote from: dom on July 20, 2008, 10:19:22 am
what i mean to say is no, not by far
Actually you're right, but the RAW advantages are often overstated and overhyped. I did some experimenting myself, and yes, improperly exposed images contained more details in the darks in the RAW file. RAW is more flexible... no doubt. That said, it tends to be a waste of time if you're printing 4x6's.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Blitzen on July 21, 2008, 04:09:00 am
I shoot in JPG for the simple reason that not all RAW formats are supported by different softwares and I don't like having the extra step of converting the files. Most of the keepers are just more readily consumable/printable if they don't need editing, which means I can take it right to the lab instead of going home and touching it up first.

If I was doing something more serious like a shoot or a concert then yeah I'd shoot in and then keep the RAWs but I don't do anything with them. Once they're converted, they just sit on a CD in this milkcrate here and I'll never look at it agian because the first converts and subsequent touchups are in JPG on my XHD.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Bobberticus on July 21, 2008, 04:57:18 am
Quote from: Mama Luigi on July 21, 2008, 03:54:10 am
Incorrect. Most cameras (all cameras?) - to my knowledge - save lossless jpegs.
Actually you're right, but the RAW advantages are often overstated and overhyped. I did some experimenting myself, and yes, improperly exposed images contained more details in the darks in the RAW file. RAW is more flexible... no doubt. That said, it tends to be a waste of time if you're printing 4x6's.

Lossless Jpeg? Unless there is something I don't know about, this seems like an oxymoron of sorts
Although the amount of quality loss that does occur is usually negligible
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: King Arthur on July 21, 2008, 05:39:54 am
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lossless_JPEG

However, as the wiki article says I have not seen this used in that many places. Though I'm sure there's bound to be someone more knowledgable on this subject.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: dom on July 21, 2008, 11:01:31 am
There's not much point in saving as lossless JPEG when you can just save as RAW because i really doubt the compression on lossless JPEG is very sizeable (because it's REALLY hard to compress photographic images losslessly)
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Mama Luigi on July 24, 2008, 06:17:53 pm
I was going to do this yesterday and I feel like kind of a jackass for bumping this but I wanted to clear this up. I wasn't even aware that there was a lossless format jpeg... it seems rather unnecessary as jpeg can be lossless as is.

Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: goat on July 24, 2008, 06:33:23 pm
Quote from: Mama Luigi on July 24, 2008, 06:17:53 pm
I was going to do this yesterday and I feel like kind of a jackass for bumping this but I wanted to clear this up. I wasn't even aware that there was a lossless format jpeg... it seems rather unnecessary as jpeg can be lossless as is.


Toggling them through browser tabs, the jpeg seems brighter. Not sure if that's good or bad, but definitely different. I would say theres loss there if it is ANY different from the original.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Mama Luigi on July 24, 2008, 08:37:17 pm
The RAW picture was processed through Photoshop CS3. I matched the white balance and brightness as close as I could without getting too picky. Sorry if there's a little brightness variation... with a little more time, I could have made a perfect match. Also, I don't know if it matters, but the ones on the right are 16 bit PNGs, while the ones on the left are 8 bit.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Alec on July 24, 2008, 08:50:40 pm
also, it's different since you took the pictures in JPEG and converted them to RAW. Try taking it in RAW and converting it to JPEG.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Mama Luigi on July 24, 2008, 09:11:54 pm
Quote from: Alec on July 24, 2008, 08:50:40 pm
also, it's different since you took the pictures in JPEG and converted them to RAW. Try taking it in RAW and converting it to JPEG.
no... that's not what I did at all. That's what we would call 'impossible'.

I took the JPEG that the camera produced along with it's RAW companion, made the sample screens you see, and saved them as PNG.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: Alec on July 24, 2008, 10:04:39 pm
oh okay. It seemed like, never mind!
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: goat on July 25, 2008, 11:23:37 pm
Quote from: Mama Luigi on July 24, 2008, 08:37:17 pm
The RAW picture was processed through Photoshop CS3. I matched the white balance and brightness as close as I could without getting too picky. Sorry if there's a little brightness variation... with a little more time, I could have made a perfect match. Also, I don't know if it matters, but the ones on the right are 16 bit PNGs, while the ones on the left are 8 bit.

I'm just saying, THAT there was any difference between them to begin with, means that there's some sort of loss there.
Title: [SOLVED] urgent help needed reading/converting a .RAW file
Post by: dada on July 27, 2008, 08:14:01 am
Time to clear some things up.

Quote from: Mama Luigi on July 21, 2008, 03:54:10 am
Incorrect. Most cameras (all cameras?) - to my knowledge - save lossless jpegs.
Nope. Very few cameras do. Many just save a very high-quality JPEG. It's close, but not entirely lossless (but often good enough). Note that this is for practical reasons; very few programs can even decode lossless JPEG.

Quote from: Mama Luigi on July 21, 2008, 03:54:10 am
Actually you're right, but the RAW advantages are often overstated and overhyped.
If you're a professional or a slightly more serious amateur, this is absolutely untrue. The lighting conditions of the scene you're shooting are never perfect. If you save your image in JPEG, you'll lose your chance to adjust it without giving up some quality later.