Gaming World Forums
General Category => General Talk => Topic started by: missingno on July 31, 2008, 05:28:02 pm
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okay guys here's one that i need your help with. i am humbly asking for the assistance of this community.
trains
tell me all you know about them (and don't be smartasses and be like "they go on tracks lol"). this is for a major project of mine (non-rpg maker!!) and i need to do some major research.
i don't necessarily mean any one specific type of train either (although subways and shit are less important than steam trains), i'm interested in learning absolutely as much as i can about the topic.
obviously my starting point is wikipedia, and it is fantastic for general stuff but my story is taking place ON THE TRAINS THEMSELVES and i really need to get the FEEL and stuff for TRAIN LIFE.
if anybody knows any good resources that really get into the detail of trains and their crews and how they're mangaed and how they work it would be seriously appreciated.
even more, if anybody has any experience working on trains or railroads or knows anybody who may be able to talk to me it would be seriously appreciated.
ty!!!
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Go to the library? Or use Google? If this is a major project I'm not sure why you think HEY GW WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT TRAINS is a great idea. I really only see two outcomes: A person will either have been on a train and tell you something like IT WAS FAST, which you said you didn't want, or they will have incredible knowledge of trains (unlikely), but won't feel like typing out a report on them.
EDIT: Since you wasted all that time typing this instead of typing into Google, here:
http://www.sciencetech.technomuses.ca/english/schoolzone/Info_Trains.cfm
http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/question275.htm
http://library.thinkquest.org/04oct/00450/steamanddiesel.htm
http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/blsteamengine.htm
http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/blrailroad.htm
http://www.railroad.net/articles/railfanning/worktrains/index.php
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I have a good knowledge and was on a steam train on Tuesday! Let me gather my informations and refresh my memory...
It's probably better if you ask us questions so we can tell you exactly what you need to know rather than unnecessary information on the use of shunters etc.
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Perhaps try to imagine what it would be like if say... trains didn't have a roof (like a convertable), or if you could open the windows...
Things that you either can't or won't do on a train are good places to start, for example the train gives you that added feel of security seeings as how the air is so motionless inside it, barely feels like you're moving.
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My dad is a train mechanic or something. He lives in nebraska. One time when I was younger I went to his work and got a bunch of earplugs and a hard hat. Trains are pretty cool.
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Go to the library? Or use Google?
Yeah those are obvious, but they can't really give the personal feeling and stuff associated with what I'm looking for. As well as the "what if" kind of things. It's easy to find out how they work and that kind of thing, but the actual life of someone who lives and works with trains is more personal and you can't get that from a library or google. sorry if that wasn't clear!!
It's probably better if you ask us questions so we can tell you exactly what you need to know rather than unnecessary information on the use of shunters etc.
good idea!!
some general things that i'm interested in (for the story)
- LIVING on a train (cooking, eating, sleeping, etc).
- personally-owned trains (owning your own train for the fun of it (or freelance cargo shipments??? idk) rather than working on a company's train)
- could a single person operate a train? maybe not realistically but with enhancements/machines etc how plausible/possible is this??
- autopilot/cruise control????
- if we lived in a world that was far more spread out than it is and we didn't really have cars and stuff, and everything between cities was pretty much trains, how would train tracks work? in terms of being interconnected and stuff, and rail switches and the like (or even is this plausible at all?)
- trains cannot TURN right?
that kind of stuff. i'm VERY much intersted in the whole possibility of living on a moving train.
see the problem is that i came up with this world and story without knowing much about trains themseles. and by now i have invested so much into the story and characters, and it's time to actually DO SOMETHING with this and i realize that i don't know enough to make it realistic in any way!!
also in response to an ovious answer: I plan to take a steam train trip at some point. There's a local steam train ride thing that's somewhat of an amusement thing for people. I did it when I was a little kid, I remeber. I'd like to take a ride on that and spend some time talking with the crew.
i hope that helps this topic have a but more function
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Owning your own train for personal purposes..?
Isn't that a bit limited considering your whole "they go on tracks lol" statement?
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It only takes about 2 guys to run a steam train, the extra staff is security and maintanence. No train due to weight can come to an instant stop, steam trains runs off coal and one guy operates the switchs, communications, and whistle. Theres more but i'm a little bit busy. Steam trains go up to a maximum of 40 miles an hour.
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LIVING on a train (cooking, eating, sleeping, etc).
Cooking - food on trains is usually prepared beforehand and kept heated (or cooled) on the train in the buffet car.
Eating - Said food (mostly snacks and drinks) can be bought from the buffet car, but on longer journeys a full-course meal can be served in the restaurant cars. I've done this before and the quality of food is usually pretty great for food in transit!
Sleeping - only on stopover journeys! A lot of the long distance European trains have beds on them, I don't have any experience of them though so you may want someone else to fill you in on this.
personally-owned trains (owning your own train for the fun of it (or freelance cargo shipments??? idk) rather than working on a company's train)
I have never heard of this happening! Rail transport is an expensive business so I wouldn't be surprised if this was pretty impossible. I don't think this is much of an option!
could a single person operate a train? maybe not realistically but with enhancements/machines etc how plausible/possible is this??
Again, not that plausible. Operating a single engine is a two man job (driver and fireman), and with a whole train there also used to be a brake van (caboose in the US), and that's where the conductor and train crew work from. That's at least 4 people on a goods train (no need for a conductor), and at least 5 on a passenger train.
autopilot/cruise control????
This is a bad idea! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hinton_train_collision) Well, not so much nowadays, but if you're going for something period you might want to read up on that accident (that article is just an overview really) and the railroader culture of that time!
if we lived in a world that was far more spread out than it is and we didn't really have cars and stuff, and everything between cities was pretty much trains, how would train tracks work? in terms of being interconnected and stuff, and rail switches and the like (or even is this plausible at all?)
My guess is a bit like this (http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/tocs_maps/maps/NationalRailSchematicMapLarge.pdf), but on a larger scale! It's actually quite plausible. As long as there's good administration and organisation (as well as the manpower) behind it, rail switches and such wouldn't really be much of an issue.
trains cannot TURN right?
Well, no, in the sense that the trains themselves don't have steering. However, you have not accounted for curves in the track! That is how trains change direction. Junctions are done with points, though these can cause problems and accidents if they're not managed properly. For turning trains round at a station or engine shed, turntables are used.
also in response to an ovious answer: I plan to take a steam train trip at some point. There's a local steam train ride thing that's somewhat of an amusement thing for people. I did it when I was a little kid, I remeber. I'd like to take a ride on that and spend some time talking with the crew.
Arrive at the station early and chat with them on the platform. Driving and powering a steam engine is a gruelling business and I'm sure they don't want to be questioned while working.
Bear in mind my knowledge is mostly of steam railways so don't be surprised if some of this information is a little bit out of date!
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- LIVING on a train (cooking, eating, sleeping, etc).
- personally-owned trains (owning your own train for the fun of it (or freelance cargo shipments??? idk) rather than working on a company's train)
- could a single person operate a train? maybe not realistically but with enhancements/machines etc how plausible/possible is this??
- autopilot/cruise control????
- if we lived in a world that was far more spread out than it is and we didn't really have cars and stuff, and everything between cities was pretty much trains, how would train tracks work? in terms of being interconnected and stuff, and rail switches and the like (or even is this plausible at all?)
- trains cannot TURN right?
my uncle is a freight train driver so i can answer these
you could live on a train but idk why you would want to?? nobody could visit or anything
you could own a personal train but you would also need your personal track! only one train can go on a track at one time in one direction between two stations (like, el paso to tucson or something) for obvious reasons. you couldnt do freelance freight because your train would collide with other trains (do you even use your brain?) and each railway company owns the various stretches of rail
generally there are crews of four but a freight train can be operated by an individual
freight trains have autopilot
if everything was more spread out there would still be cars... traveling via highway is much faster than rail
and uh trains can turn did you think they just went in a straight line everywhere!?!?!?
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traveling via highway is much faster than rail
I would like to contest this! I dunno what rail transport is like where you are but over here the same 300 mile journey that would take 5 hours 20 by road would take 4 hours by rail.
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http://www.railroadforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=24849
thank me later
edit:
oh and
Railroad Photos and Trip Reports - Midwestern US (254 Viewing)
Photos of railroads in the central and mid-western United States. (Chicago to Denver)
this forum obviously rocks
putting the replies in this topic for future reference
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LIVING on a train (cooking, eating, sleeping, etc).- Doesn't happen anymore (in the U.S.A.) but in the old days the caboose was where the crew did all that eating and sleeping and stuff. Modern locomotives have Bathrooms and small refrigerators in them. Now train crews are put up in motels if need be since the train crew is only allowed to run a train for only a certain number of hours.
personally-owned trains (owning your own train for the fun of it (or freelance cargo shipments??? idk) rather than working on a company's train)- Very very raire but a few people have had them more common are people who own there own passenger car and pay someone like Amtrak to tow them around on the back of there trains more info here http://www.aaprco.com/
could a single person operate a train? maybe not realistically but with enhancements/machines etc how plausible/possible is this??
* autopilot/cruise control????- Yes some subways have no drivers at all more info here http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1215/is_n2_v190/ai_7393869
* if we lived in a world that was far more spread out than it is and we didn't really have cars and stuff, and everything between cities was pretty much trains, how would train tracks work? in terms of being interconnected and stuff, and rail switches and the like (or even is this plausible at all?) - Train tracks are inter connected throughout all of North America in fact almost 50% of all Freight goes by railroad. For trains to turn see this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railroad_switch and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turntable_%28rail%29
Also get someone who knows about trains to read it over and help you make corrections if need be
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thanks guys this is some good information. so far the world is shaping up in more detail, things are being refined, etc.
train tracks are public, owned and operated by the government (this eliminates the largest problem by far-- which is train tracks being owned by companies which kills the idea of personally-owned trains, which is what the entire story is based on). trains have radio contact with "operator" stations who run the switches and keep tabs on where trains are, and the operatros could also link trains contact with each other. tracks would also be painted in a way that signifieis the direction so we dont have to worry about crashes
plausible?
lars holy shit that is a pretty cool forum (actually they seem kind of :blarg:) but useful!!! i did not know it existed
you got me a warning for FOWL language :o
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Painted to signify the direction? What are they going to repaint the trains everytime they need to turn?
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the tracks
also what would call someone who owns and runs their own train. originally i was thinking CONDUCTOR but that doesn't really work, as i've since then found out that ENGINEER is the one who actually does stuff, and conductor is more of staff for passgener trains. engineer doesn't really seem right, either though. this is quite a dilemma because the title was originally "the conductor" and now it has to be "the _____"
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the tracks
Oh, I read it as trains. Sorry, although it still doesn't make much sense because trains move back and forth on tracks often.
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Track A is blue for back and forth to Town 1 to Town 2, Track B is painted red for back and forth to Town 3 and Town 4 is what he's saying I believe.
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I suppose, but it's pretty easy to say "HEY THIS TRACK IS GOING EAST THE TRAIN MUST BE GOING EAST"
I guess at a train station where there are a number of tracks, but then it's really no different than painting a "B TRAIN" or "N67 TRAIN" on the side of the carts. Also it would be more reasonable than painting the entire track.
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speaking of sleeping on trains, I remember 6 of us in a room the size of our house's smallest bathroom. That was fun.
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lol smartasses is "fowl" language that's awesome
i just can't get over the fact that they have TRIP REPORTS for train rides
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As terrible as it was
watch the movie 'The Darjeeling Limited'. granted thats pretty screwball but yeah there is some subtlety to it
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Have you ever seen a train move, by any chance? It'd answer a lot of questions if you had, I think. Did you know trains go on rails? It derives a lot of its properties from this fact. For one, a single rail can only accommodate for trains going in one direction, because of, you know, the big crashes involved if you disregard this. In the Netherlands, there are always two tracks running side by side because of this, and no switching. Not having this in Trainworld would be extremely suicidal. And so would having a bloody autopilot be! You know that scene in the War of the Worlds film with Tom Cruise with the burning train speeding by at Mach 3? That's how stupid it is. Over here a person has to hold a button down to make the train go anywhere at all, for obvious reasons (commonly referred to as the dead man's switch). You could probably rig a steam train to keep going, but it'd either boil dry and explode or go out and stop after a while.
Oh, and a country doesn't have to be spread out and not have cars for it to have an extensive railway network. Holland is cramped as fuck, but just about every city has a station, or is less than a fifteen-minute bus trip from one. Big cities have multiple stations. You can imagine proper regulation is really bloody important (and so is not trusting computers, like, at all).
I rely on the train for public transport, so I could tell you about modern commuting, I guess (it's dull). But, the longest time without stops is about half an hour here in the Netherlands, so life on a train is pretty impossible.
My advice to you is to go on a train trip for a day. It's a bit costly, but nothing beats first-hand experience.
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Cramped, boring.
You spend a lot of the time endlessly staring out the window, looking at things pass by.
You get annoying little kids that cry and scream when you're trying to get some sleep.
You get people with food trolleys that ask if you wanna buy something, so you do, but it costs a ridiculous amount.
You ALWAYS get delayed.
I used to do 9 hour train journeys every month, so I think I know.
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I find the train infinetly more pleasant and definetly cost-effective than the bus.
My favourite part of the train is looking out the window when you're travelling at a higher speed, and then you begin to see the foreground blur together in horizontal lines of colour and the background scroll by behind it. Its just a but surreal.
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Have you ever seen a train move, by any chance? It'd answer a lot of questions if you had, I think. Did you know trains go on rails? It derives a lot of its properties from this fact. For one, a single rail can only accommodate for trains going in one direction, because of, you know, the big crashes involved if you disregard this. In the Netherlands, there are always two tracks running side by side because of this
obviously
Oh, and a country doesn't have to be spread out and not have cars for it to have an extensive railway network. Holland is cramped as fuck, but just about every city has a station, or is less than a fifteen-minute bus trip from one. Big cities have multiple stations. You can imagine proper regulation is really bloody important (and so is not trusting computers, like, at all).
It's big and spread out not to HAVE a train network but to have one as i envision for the story (ie. LONG ASS TRIPS that take multiple days)
My advice to you is to go on a train trip for a day. It's a bit costly, but nothing beats first-hand experience.
I've been on trains multiple times, but always passnger trains with lots of stops and shit and that's not exactly what I'm going for here. like I said though i'm going to try and take a steam train ride at some point
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Well... i've taken a long trip. It's fairly boring, and steam trains well they tend to rock back and forth a bit. Especially on those tracks where maintanence is a little behind. If you've never been on a steam train before getting on one is a bit exciting. Food is expensive and if you want you could talk to a few of the staff but you gotta make sure they arn't busy. Theres restaurant cars, good food. If your the type that drops lack a sack of potatoes on long trips the rocking is like a baby crib and eerily relaxing. Fairly quiet by yourself could be loud if someones arguing, and you could read a book or something the one I was on didn't have any electrical outlets. A neat compartment and stops were uncommonbut all in all it was just a calm, relaxing, sometimes boring trip.
I want to ride that really fancy train they have in Japan next, i've heard the experience is pretty neat.
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My physics teacher in 12th grade was about 60 and would say really offensive things and then justify himself by saying "I'm just an old country boy," and he wore silly shirts on Fridays. One of them had a trains all over it and when we asked him he told us he got it out of the back of the catalog that he orders his toy trains out of and apparently his basement is filled with them. Also, his son got a scholarship for clown college because he can ride a unicycle and juggle at the same time.
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I want to go to Clown College. But I'm just a GWer. I can haz scholarsheep?
I hate trains, mostly because they still use that ripped up leather upholstery that smells like shit. There's nothing more annoying than sitting uncomfortably in a blazing hot train, with the smell of burnt leather wafting into your throat, with your only entertainment as the graffiti in front of you.