• Comrade!
  • Group: Member
  • Joined: Oct 12, 2005
  • Posts: 30
It's hard to work in a genre that isn't well established because you have to stop and think at every step and sometimes do huge amounts of research rather than just relying on past works, so it makes sense that people will either stick to whatever few themes are proven to work, or try to port them over from other genres as best as they can.

The best example I have is from Starcraft mapping where nearly all RPG custom maps (it's very moddable ok) try to be fantasy despite the overwhelming odds they have to face (scifi-styled setting, creatures, sounds and everything) even if it involves renaming what's obviously a space cruiser with laser weapons to "Acid-Spitting Hydra Level 2" and a guy with a rifle to "Elven Archer".
There's a few good scifi rpgs but not many because being the first is fucking hard.

There's nothing much you can do about it other than knuckling down and doing the research, whether it's for completely new shit or good analogues to what works in fantasy/other genres.

Yeah, you are right.  It really comes down to doing research.  But that's the fun part, for me at least.  For my game, I have already done a huge amount of research (being interested in space colonization) before I even conceived of the game idea, so that definitely helps out a lot. 
http://kuopdevelopment.blogspot.com/
  • Comrade!
  • Group: Member
  • Joined: Oct 12, 2005
  • Posts: 30
Yes, I am suggesting that the reason there are so many science fiction clichés is that people take the bounds of the genre too seriously. I mean obviously it is still important to be aware of the genre if you're prone to science oriented settings but it might be useful to think less about sci-fi and more about everything else.

Of course, it is useful to think about everything else.  I agree that I take the bounds of the genre seriously.  But I don't think that it is hampering my creativity.  I don't have a demo out yet of my sci-fi rpg, and it won't be out for at least a couple more months.  But I would have to say that my game is probably a lot more strict than most other games when it comes to science fiction.  But that is mainly because in the particular series I am creating I want to do away with magic and totally replace it with science and technology, and also do away with swords.  I want to explore how hard sci fi I can make the game.  Of course, there will be some pseudoscience because assuming that today's exact same set of scientific theories will still be in effect 100 years from now is unrealistic.  

Again, the demo is not out yet, but the storyline is totally original.  It is a space setting, but only uses the Earth-Moon system.  There are no aliens whatsoever.  Instead, there is just a diversity of people and cultures (which solves another pet peeve of mine: Tolkienism).  No warp drives, no FTL travel.  Also, the game will explore modern (and futuristic) social and political issues.  And the game will actually have modern political systems, instead of monarchies.  So I don't think it is merely a matter of boundaries.  
http://kuopdevelopment.blogspot.com/
  • Comrade!
  • Group: Member
  • Joined: Oct 12, 2005
  • Posts: 30
I think it's better to take science fiction and fantasy as setting ideas than as a genre you have to kind of be inside. When I am thinking about world-building (not very frequently these days) I mostly think about the kinds of aesthetics that best fit with what I want to discuss in the game. Often with me it comes out kind of sci-fi but that's a reflection over the kinds of thoughts I have ("What would it be like to graffiti a space station?", "Suppose there were gods like those of greek mythology active in the 1920s.") rather than a conscious choice to think up a "Science Fiction" universe or plot-line. Maybe you are really into using genres to plan settings, but don't you think it can get in the way of what you really want to explore?

I'm not really into genres to plan settings, per se.  I find nothing wrong with Zeus in 1925.  That is cool.  But there are too many cliches in science fiction RPGs.  Normally, I don't care too much for cliches, but when you normally play a sword wielding character in a Star Trek esque setting, when while everyone else had assault rifles, then I think that someone needs to try something different. 

Also, science fiction is a huge category, but most ideas are under-exploited.  It seems that science fiction RPGs fall into three categories: a post-apocalyptic world, a space opera (where you normally walk in dark corridors on a space ship...who would want to live in dark corridors all the time) in which you fight an alien invasion, or (more rare than the others) a biodisaster.  There are a whole lot of unexplored ideas in the science fiction RPG field that would make for some awesome RPGs. And even those three ideas of space opera, post-apocalypse, and biodisaster can be greatly improved upon.

And also, I am interested in the ideas expressed in science fiction.  Science fiction has been a medium for expressing our most profound thoughts and ideas.  Not just ideas about technology, but ideas about humanity, life, the universe, etc.  And this is one area where I think we can do better. 
http://kuopdevelopment.blogspot.com/
  • Comrade!
  • Group: Member
  • Joined: Oct 12, 2005
  • Posts: 30
One major gripe that I have with science fiction RPGs is the usage of swords in an era of interstellar travel and colonization.  Now this does not make sense to me at all.  Worse of all is that when you play RPGs set in the present day, the developers usually have enough sense to do away with the sword.  But not when the story is set 200 years into the future.  When you play futuristic RPGs, the main hero is using a sword.  Now, I know that having a sword in a futuristic RPG can be good at times.  But don't make it a freaking habit!  Just because Cloud and Squall both used swords doesn't mean that swords should be used in every science fiction RPG.  The Star Ocean series might be a major reason I am doing this thread.  It's bad enough that you always end up spending most of the game on a medieval planet where everyone still uses magic and swords in the Star Ocean series.  But the fact that Star Ocean heavily copies Star Trek just throws me for a loop.  I mean, unless you are playing a Holodeck simulation of the past, or you are doing Klingon fighting using the Sword of Khaless, there is absolutely no sword fighting in Star Trek.  Do you know what the use instead?  Yes, that's right!  They use guns, and more specifically, phasers.  So why is it, that when playing Star Ocean: The Last Hope, my main character is walking around a space ship with a sword as his main weapon.  And then they come up with a retarded ass plot device in which guns are useless against aliens, but some magical sword can defeat them.  Really guys, WTF?  Am I the only one bothered by this shit?  Of course, many other science fiction RPGs do the same.  

One commercial RPG that does well is Xenosaga.  Xenosaga is one science fiction RPG that gets plenty right.  I've only played the first one though, so I can't comment on the rest of the series.  But I like the fact that they actually use guns.  Alter A.I.L.A. also does well in this regard.  One refrain that I often hear against using guns in RPGs is that it is totally unrealistic for player stats to affect guns.  But that is totally not true.  Using guns require at least a little skill.  For one thing, you have to be able to hold the gun steady.  Second, aim is important.  Of course, if you strike the heart or the brain, then you die.  But that is not necessarily the case if you hit another part of the body.  Also, while you cannot directly dodge a bullet, your evasive skills can make it harder for a person to effectively target you.  So you can make gun battles realistic; or, more accurately, as realistic as sword battles are in RPGs.
http://kuopdevelopment.blogspot.com/
  • Comrade!
  • Group: Member
  • Joined: Oct 12, 2005
  • Posts: 30
The overwhelming majority of RPGs are, of course, set in medieval/classic fantasy and mythology.  Science fiction RPGs are much more rare, and I tend to favor futuristic settings and plots.  I have played many science fiction RPGs.  While most of them are good, there many areas where they could be improved.  Even with the small number of sci-fi RPGs, I can see many cliches.  The purpose of this thread is to get people thinking and talking about creating a good science fiction RPG.  And hopefully, more people will attempt to make science fiction RPGs, and make original and enlightening works at best.  I will post many, many different ideas in this thread, and hopefully, you will too. 
http://kuopdevelopment.blogspot.com/
  • Comrade!
  • Group: Member
  • Joined: Oct 12, 2005
  • Posts: 30
The reason people don't make there own graphics is that drawing new sprites and tilesets is extremely time consuming.  Most of us go to school and/or work, and just don't have time to practice drawing.  If you want to be a professional, then you need to learn how to draw.    But most of us just want to make games, and drawing your own resources will add several months of development time at least.  Because of that, I just use resources from Charas Project. 
http://kuopdevelopment.blogspot.com/
  • Comrade!
  • Group: Member
  • Joined: Oct 12, 2005
  • Posts: 30
Why did I get completely ignored.
That is a very nice screenshot.  What project is that, may I ask?
http://kuopdevelopment.blogspot.com/
  • Comrade!
  • Group: Member
  • Joined: Oct 12, 2005
  • Posts: 30
Well... in what kind of place you have chairs facing a tree?

LOL!! Good point.  Guess I was using that as filler for the hall.
http://kuopdevelopment.blogspot.com/
  • Comrade!
  • Group: Member
  • Joined: Oct 12, 2005
  • Posts: 30
cumulonimbus: Nice menu. The map looks a bit empty though. Looks like a test map actually, am I right? Anyways, is the menu accessible from anywhere, and does it appear plainly on the top of the screen? I would suggest darkening the background when the menu is called. The way it is, looks a bit messy, and the white font is hard to read.
Quote

Thanks.  Yes, that is an actual menu pic, and that is an actual map.  No mock-ups there.  I know I need to work on my mapping skills, though. 
http://kuopdevelopment.blogspot.com/