I've always liked the idea of Silent Hill more than the games themselves. Most of the games aren't very good, and if they were by themselves and not part of the idea of the place I probably wouldn't care about them. I don't care about demonic cults or coal fires or having a baby god, and stuff like that. All of the games have elements of that in it, I think (i haven't played them all), apart from 2 and the remake of the first one, Silent Hill: Shattered Memories. Those are my two favourite ones. I definitely like 2 more than SM, but both of them have problems. The whole series is a big mess, and isn't really about what I think it should be about, which is what 2 was about.

I'm talking about the idea that the town is a place where the state of someone's head can affect the form of the place, and that the whole thing is set up to be a kind of trial ground for people who need to work through problems or are lost and things like that.  A place where people who need to give themselves a shake end up somehow. The literal explanation of the whole thing isn't imporant - it kills the whole fun for me to try and explain it, which is why I don't like the cult stuff - it's all about being a really flexible vehicle to explore a whole lot of different kinds of ideas. 2 is obviously the one which does this the most. It's all about [spoiler[James' ][/spoiler[James'] and all that stuff. Most of the elements of the game are designed to help give some complexity and background to that story, although I don't think really quite as much as people pretend they are. It was a good start, though. The problem with Silent Hill is that they never built on that, as far as I know. They didn't try, because the following games were just about daft crap with alot less thought put into why the things were happening. I played three and I was put off by all the WHOAH LOOK HOW FREAKY IT IS - A BIG WORM! A BUNNY MAN! It did LOOK pretty cool when the town went wild in that one, they took the idea further along, but that was just looks.

I won't go on for too long just now, so, anyway, they are making a new Silent Hill. It's made by western developers again, Vatra Games, who apparently are based in the Czech Republic. I don't think they have done a Silent Hill game before. Akira Yamokka is not doing the music this time, which is too bad because I like his ambient/lofi style stuff, and they are getting in Rolf Kent to do the music, who I know from doing the Dexter soundtrack which is the best part of that shitty show. So the music could be pretty good. From the trailer, though, the game doesn't look very interesting. The characters seem barely distinguishable from the ones I've seen in the previous games, and they weren't very interesting then, either. The prisoner idea seems like it could be okay, like it seems at least on theme, but it's a bit obvious and will probably not be handled well.

Here's that E3 trailer of the one they're making:


The music in the trailer is alright. I can hear Dexter in it. It all looks a bit traditionally spooky, and someone should have just said 'Nah' when the idea of putting a spooky little girl in the game was floated. The transition into the scary world at the end was also really horrible. I never really liked that idea. I'll play it.




 

Yeah, I liked shattered memories partly because of the reasons you mentioned, too. Although, 3 has alot of combat and as far as I can remember the plot wasn't as interesting although there's still stuff to like about it. I remember liking the beginning of it, the very beginning.

shattered memories had alot of exploration in it, which I always wished 2 had more of. Not that shattered memories let you go off on your own very much, but the areas were pretty big and they sometimes tricked you a little by giving you a couple of routes to get to where you where going. I always liked looking around and as often as not having harry say something about the thing I was looking at. I liked the more relaxed spooky atmosphere. It never really even tries to scare you, the place is just empty and is spooky at times simply because of that.

My favourite part about shattered memories is that it actually veered into some depressing stuff at times. For a while, I thought Harry had actually sexually assaulted his own daughter, because of the stuff with Daliah, who looked just like her and was sexualised in harry's mind depending on how you acted. It didn't end up going that way, no matter what ending you direct the game towards, so it was a bit of a let down because for a while, I was freaked out by what I thought my character was like rather than by the monsters or anything like that. I thought they were telling me a story about a man who looks nice at first but then turns into Bad Dad. I just remember being pretty captivated by what was going on and the various people you meet through the game for a while. Actually, pretty much from the start of it until the ending come to think of it. There were alot of bad bits - like the dumb screams and hauntings and stuff like that, shattered memories was pretty good, yeah.

I only played Silent Hill 2 and didn't get very far but yeah I do think there was something there which uh transcended all the stuff about clock puzzles and beating mutants with sticks. I think it has to do with your idea of the city changing to reflect someone's head, or maybe the idea that there's always something there under the surface of places anyway which comes out if you're in the right state of mind: stuff like the radio bursting into static, or deserted apartments, or strange stains, or old videotapes, or certain buildings, or just general places and events where the world almost seems to break down and turn into the shape of something different (how...... hauntological lol). I didn't see The Ring or anything like that so maybe this is just a generic thing in Japanese horror stuff?? But it's a pretty interesting/evocative idea and I think one that works well with the sense of exploring a world in 3d games that maybe gives it all an impact which outweights all the generic Mists & Monsters stuff.

if we're gonna go ahead and post silent hill music then here's another one from shattered memories i like a whole lot


this song really really sucked me into the intro, along with harry constantly shouting 'cheryl!?' no matter what button you pushed. that intro was very good.


this is another one i like alot. the name is good. that's kind of how i felt playing certain parts of shattered memories, although it was too cheesey to keep it up. lives wasted away is what i'd like the starting point for silent hill to be.

I only played Silent Hill 2 and didn't get very far but yeah I do think there was something there which uh transcended all the stuff about clock puzzles and beating mutants with sticks. I think it has to do with your idea of the city changing to reflect someone's head, or maybe the idea that there's always something there under the surface of places anyway which comes out if you're in the right state of mind: stuff like the radio bursting into static, or deserted apartments, or strange stains, or old videotapes, or certain buildings, or just general places and events where the world almost seems to break down and turn into the shape of something different (how...... hauntological lol). I didn't see The Ring or anything like that so maybe this is just a generic thing in Japanese horror stuff?? But it's a pretty interesting/evocative idea and I think one that works well with the sense of exploring a world in 3d games that maybe gives it all an impact which outweights all the generic Mists & Monsters stuff.

i don't have the wherewithal to respond yet but i like this post. you seem to have the same ideas about why silent hill is cool or should be cool as i do.

j acobs ladder


and I dunno probably some david lynch too? (silent hill might have a lot of originality just implying japan is american pop culture's little brother who takes idea and adds dragons or some shit to make it more rad and awesome)

Edit: In all honesty I like Japan's take on shit like in Resident Evil bad horror movies this is why Hideo Kojima kind of rubs everyone the wrong way now because Metal Gear is like this strange take on American action movies ridiculous image of america where hopefully Japanese don't really think all Americans look like GUILE or something some army man who loves america and doesn't afraid of anything. But yeah the problem with Kojima's games is he's trying to be all weird and edgy this way but Japanese videogames about America were already like this with this weird bizarro version of/their country's understanding of our country   P.S. sorry non-americans. But yeah just the WEST in general esp. with fighting games and stuff  fighting games in general are hilarious I hope the designers aren't very serious I guess not with SNK doing like 3 different guys who are ripoffs of Ken from Street Fighter. I need to watch that movie that inspired Final Fight I am intriguied by this idea forming a holistic image of America just from watching some random movie from the 80's making pointing out still frames of the movie to other team members in Capcom office with one of those school pointing sticks with the rubber tips

Edit: I think if you put all fighting games side by side besides America British people Germans Spaniards Russians are always this odd caricature like all Germans are acrobats because of some random thing that made Japanese think that Olympics or something. And if you're form Europe there's probably a pretty good chance you're royalty and simultaneously fight in your panties for som e reason

Edit: but yeah advice to Japanese game developers of today with the internet and all you might be tempted to actually do RESEARCH and stuff for your upcoming PS3 game but please refrain and just use the first image of western cultures that pops into your head no matter how inaccurate or bizarre or freudian it is

also old school final fantasys throwing random gods and goddesses from obscure religions to have as a 2-second magic spell in your game good times


Edit: are there like any jewish characters in games/anime

ragnar what on earth are you talking about

ragnar what on earth are you talking about

was sort of asking is Silent Hill really that clever of a series or is it just shamelessly copying American movies like Jacob's Ladder/Japanese horror techniques and both of these are kind of obscure to Americans so it seems more originaly than it really is. Or are people aware of this and it's just their particular interpretation of random movies and stuff is interesting.
Then going off on a tangent I think this is the appeal of a lot of retro video games when you're playing Street Fighter II and your choice playing as an American is Ken or Guile or fake Mike Tyson or that native american guy later on who else was supposed to be from America and Resident Evil there's probably hilariously 'off' things about Raccoon City if you think about it
   And saying how Hideo Kojima kind of exploited this about videogames but just labeled it as weird and postmodern but if he didn't say that how many people would be like 'oh a videogame from Japan about Americans' that's maybe why he bugs people now or maybe just that Metal Gear was cooler when we were 13 i dunno

Ugh. I played the original on PS1. and I hate how they changed and retconed story stuff in Shattered memories. Also, They made Harry look and act sort of like a nerdy guy. Harry mason wasn't really nerdy at all in the first game...

I agree with this completely.  The PS1 Silent Hill was also the first one I played and I didn't like how they changed the story in Shattered Memories.  I have played SM and gameplay wise it's fine but I just couldn't wrap my head around how they made everything so much different.  They completely ruined Harry and I adored him in the first game.

In terms of story SH2 probably did it best but it was also one of the least scary games in the series.

lol random but I remember when this game first came out and I thought it was just going to be shameless ripoff of Resident Evil and would be forgotten instantly. Funny how we're all going on about what an interesting concept the game is if not anything else and it's the eighth game in the series is it?

First 3 games are really good but the 4th one was a piece of shit and the titles beyond that I have not played, nor will I.

It was all a lot better when they didn't explain everything that was going on, just some subtle hints every here and there that you can choose to ignore if you don't give a shit.

I am in the minority that enjoyed 4 and didn't like 3. 2 is still my favorite with its story and character development, but something about the first one was more unsettling to me.

I haven't played any of the other ones, but I don't think I'm really missing out.

i like the silent hill games in theory, but i could never really get into any of them. i don't really have much tolerance for the horror genre, particularly when the controls deliberately handicap you, so i never really met the prerequisites for playing/enjoying the game. it's a shame because the core concept of silent hill is great, but i don't think it's executed particularly well. it kinda treads on the kafka/lynch territory but at the end of the day is really more like jacob's ladder than anything else, which i strongly disliked. not enough incentive for me.

akira yamaoka's music is fucking great though. rather than bother pushing myself through the game i decided to just put the soundtrack on my mp3 player and walk around town at 3 in the morning listening to it. i've done this countless times over the years, actually. i've played enough of these games to know that this is a pretty worthwhile substitute.

also it's pretty cool that yamaoka has dumped konami and joined grasshopper to work with suda 51. that should be interesting.