in related news

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/shortcuts/2012/jul/10/john-terry-foul-language-football

The most shocking revelation in the John Terry trial so far is what is regarded as acceptable abuse, sarcasm and banter on the Premier League football pitch. "Cunt"? Perfectly fine. "Fucking knobhead." Nowt wrong with that. It's only when one starts ascribing racial epithets to terms of abuse that we get into murky water.

I think puppet master is inadvertently pointing out Poe's Law.

help im terrified of success my heart is pumping molasses to every part of my body i cant unparalyze please dont tell my future potential employer

I can get why you might not understand this, but this is basically a response to rape jokes. People don't get why women get upset at jokes involving rape, so jokes involving the murder of men for the fact that they're men are used as a way of turning the tables. And it works: people get upset when you do that and accuse you of "misandry", which is a bad joke. There are actually people who believe "radical feminists" support the murder or castration of the entire male gender--that's how badly the word has been defamed.

IDK though. I wouldn't equate rape with murder though. Shouldn't it be "rape all men"? Or maybe if you DON'T think that's strong enough, "Castrate all men".

This is just personal opinion and massive fear of the eternal nothing that is death but I'd rather be raped in the butt or even castrated than murdered and saying these things should have largely the same effect as "kill all men".

Also IDK if this in-joke is having the effect you probably are hoping for, considering people cry misandry when you say it (if I'm understanding you correctly). And Puppet master not being in on the joke could have caused more problems than it did.

Unless you want these reactions. In which case I'm confused.

I should point out that no one has actually made a rape joke in order to bring about the "kill all men" thing.

a) no, because rape as a corrective tool is a REALLY horrible thing and not something we'd joke about.  that's something that people literally do re: prison, they are GLAD that bad people get raped in prison even though guess what nobody should be raped.  saying RAPE ALL MEN is a rape joke, and i will punch people who think those are okay in the face.

Honestly, this is correct. But so is murder/killing/genocide jokes. Shouldn't you want to punch people who make genocide/murder jokes in the face as well? (I suppose this is outside of the issue of feminism entirely really)

b) it's not so much an in-joke as it is oppressed people using the language of oppression against their oppressors.  it's also a way of expressing frustration about the fact that we DON'T have the power in our society.  "oh look another man exercising his privilege ugh kill all men" there's absolutely NO bite behind it so there is no reason that anyone could even pretend to take it literally (unless they're a misogynist looking for an excuse to go SEE? WOMEN ARE WRONG).  no, we literally don't want men dead, we want patriarchy dead and this is a way of expressing that frustration as jokes amongst ourselves.

OK. I think maybe some aspects of this response may have gone over my head. I think I agree.

c) i don't give a shit who cries misandry because misandry isn't real

OK. Misandry isn't real. No women hate men. But I seriously don't think this helps the feminist cause. I just don't. but I guess I wouldn't know for certain as I haven't studied the issues enough and I'm not a woman but I'd apply this logic to every cause: It just seems like snarky/bitter/frustrated jokes aimed at people that you explicitly claim to believe are delusional wouldn't help anyone.

in summary if KILL ALL MEN is what bothers you get the heck out.

??? I don't know what you mean... Also I was merely questioning this method (and perhaps 1/2 of the goal of that method). Not your principles. And questioning doesn't mean being bothered.

I'm seriously sorry to have upset you if I have? not my intent!

having a woman express her frustration at the patriarchy in that way is nothing at all like actual oppression

But it doesn't help the situation. It just rabble-rouses and gives crazier misogynists ammo. I feel the same way about DietCoke's "kill the capitalist pigs" schtick. Maybe this is just part Saltw's culture that I just don't particularly enjoy nor think is helpful.

and going "WELL YOU *HAD* A POINT BUT THEN YOU SAID KILL ALL MEN SO THEREFORE I'M GONNA IGNORE EVERYTHING~" means you're a privileged brat.

OK, remember to separate me from this. I haven't chosen to ignore all that you have said. I Noticed this as something that merely seems (tome at least) do more harm than good.

I mean. These privileged brats, are they expected to just cease to be? are they expected to die out? are they expected to reform? does it not matter? I think it matters. I would hope one would aim to reform an unfortunately destructive individual, rather than destroy them in turn. And if that is the case with what you are aiming for I don't think this is a useful tactic for achieving such a goal.

I repeat: I don't wish to offend you, I never have had such an intention. But I had to ask these questions. I held back asking them for a while because I did not want this precise reaction and hoped it could have been avoided. I've obviously failed in that respect.

I should also specify that if I am privileged as a male (And I'm not going to deny this is probably true) I've effectively been playing the game of life on easy mode, and FAILED AT IT SPECTACULARLY. This is an all encompassing failure with maybe the exception of a mostly useless jack of all trades intellect that I have acquired.