I had a talk with a musician the other day.  I was mentioning how I downloaded all the episodes of Monty Python's Flying Circus and burned a few dvds with some episodes for my dad.  She equated that to going into a store and walking out with the official dvds.  We had a bit of a discussion about internet piracy, but not for as long as I would have liked.  The talk, however, got me thinking as to how I view internet piracy.  I came to a few conclusions.

First, I would never walk into a store and steal something off the shelves.  But, at the same time, I have no problem stealing the same product by using torrents, irc, p2p, etc.  The simplest answer I could come up with is the anonymity of the crime.  No store clerk, security camera, patron, or theft detector is going to catch me if I download something using the internet.  There's no fear of being caught, and the crime has become faceless; I don't have to see the face of the person/business I'm stealing from so it lowers the amount of guilt.  Do I still consider it stealing?  I guess, but I don't consider it the same as shoplifting because if I were to shoplift then I have stolen a hard copy of something (a CD, shoes, whatever), and the company that made that product will have to manufacture another to replace the one I've stolen.  But, when I download something, it's a digital copy made from a hard copy that was purchased.  The company doesn't have to make another item to replace the one I've downloaded, they'll just end up over producing and having more supply than demand (for all the people that don't buy their product).  It's sort of similar to only ever buying pre-owned/used goods.  The company that originally made the stuff isn't seeing a dime from your purchase.

Secondly, I do it because for most of these products, I wouldn't buy them in the first place.  This seems like a fairly hollow argument as I could say the same thing if I was apprehended for shoplifting: "Well officer, you see, I didn't actually want these so I thought I shouldn't have to pay for them".  However, when I look at this a little deeper, I realize that it might be because the things I'm stealing have no value in my mind.  The CD that I just downloaded isn't worth the $20 it would cost at a store, mainly because I can spend a few minutes searching the internet and download it for free.  That book I was interested in reading that costs $50 can be found in a torrent somewhere.  These things just aren't worth my money because they can be found anywhere and, in most cases, are exactly the same quality as they would be if you bought it from a store.

I guess I'll stop for now to keep the size of this post down, and to collect more thoughts about this.  But for now, I'm wondering what everyone else thinks about piracy.  Do you consider it stealing?  Are you concerned about companies that are losing money because of this?  Do you download pretty much everything you can, even if it's something you would normally support (a game by a company, album by an artist, etc)? 

Finally, what do you think could be done to fix the situation of internet piracy?

I'm not really sure as to what could be done about internet piracy.  It might have something to do with making products worth more in the eyes of a potential buyer.  I know for a fact that attempting to shut down p2p sites is a wasted effort as it's like cutting the heads off of a hydra.  I'll have to think for a while longer before I can come up with something good.

I tend to play computer games I download as kind of demos... ones that I stop playing. As far as music goes, I've switched over to Pandora for the most part. Whatever music or misc stuff I've download I'll usually do "guilt" buys. I'll go out and buy something I wanted but would otherwise have downloaded.

I download pretty much anything I can get my hands on.  But I will still buy things if I can't find them online and/or want to support the creators.  The greatest example is music; I haven't bought a CD in over two years, and even before that I was purchasing maybe one or two CDs a year.  However, I buy novels by my favourite authours, even brand new, but I'll still download pdfs of other books.

Without internet piracy, there would have been no other way for me to be exposed to so many types of music. I buy an album every few months, and I love having a hard copy of an album.

I download everything.

I started doing this because it was really just EASIER. But then when I decided to open a store it became more cost efficient and a way to get what I wanted while still being able to accomplish my other goals.

I tend to use piracy to test out if I actually WANT to buy things.  With movies, I'll download them and watch through them, then decide if I want to buy them.  Same thing with music, which is something that I've been really working on doing lately.

The one thing I don't pirate, though, is video games.  I don't know why, I just don't ever feel like pirating them, I guess.  I dunno.

"Intellectual property" is a misnomer. Essentially, IP grants its holder control over a whole class of information and its copies.

It would be much like the difference between owning a pine tree, and 'owning' the pine tree species. Stealing from a store is like taking a pine tree from someone's yard; wrong under most paradigms of property and ethics. However, what if someone gave you a pine tree for free that they raised in their orchid, without paying the pine tree species owner whatever they wanted?

Most justifications of this have to do with 'market regulation' or 'encouraging innovation'. I disagree that IP is necessary.

The only thing I download is music and I download really rare stuff or if I download something not rare I usually go out and by the album.  Also, like others have stated, it has got me into so many new bands and styles of music!

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Secondly, I do it because for most of these products, I wouldn't buy them in the first place.  This seems like a fairly hollow argument as I could say the same thing if I was apprehended for shoplifting: "Well officer, you see, I didn't actually want these so I thought I shouldn't have to pay for them".  However, when I look at this a little deeper, I realize that it might be because the things I'm stealing have no value in my mind.  The CD that I just downloaded isn't worth the $20 it would cost at a store, mainly because I can spend a few minutes searching the internet and download it for free.  That book I was interested in reading that costs $50 can be found in a torrent somewhere.  These things just aren't worth my money because they can be found anywhere and, in most cases, are exactly the same quality as they would be if you bought it from a store.

This. It doesn't really justify doing anything illegal but when it comes down to it it's just the way it is. I download movies and shit that I would never pay money for, especially since a lot of the time I download random movies that I've never seen/heard before and just want to try them out. If I saw something like SHANGHAI KISS at a store I wouldn't even think about buying it, but since it was in the Zoo I figured "sure why not" and it was actually a much better movie than I expected.

yeah I pretty much download music and movies because I dont have the kind of disposable income to support the collection that I like to maintain

i replaced being a moralist with being an oppritunist a long time ago.

i replaced being a moralist with being an oppritunist a long time ago.

heh me too *downloads the latest drizzt book and retires to a candlelit coven*

Well for me, it goes kinda like this:

Music:

Well, music is really fucking overpriced AND there's a really small variety here in Chile. Without Internet I would have never heard of Concerto Moon, Eva Cassidy or others, or I might have ended up paying $100 for a CD... So, I download it.

Movies, series & anime:
Pretty much the save with the addition that it's actually hard to find non-dubbed shit here...

Books:
Books I actually pay for. I can order them from ebay at reasonable prices and I can read them wherever.
This is extensible to some comics... For example, I am expecting The Sandman to arrive next week. I spent $120 on it...

Now, I've always done a difference in my mind... I don't know if this make sense to you guys, but... For me it isn't the same to download something from the internet than to buy or sell it to someone else... When doing the second, you are actually encouraging and letting someone thrive on it.

I don't have a bullshit excuse as to why I pirate except that it's free and easy.

What else can one say? There's no just answer.

I don't have a bullshit excuse as to why I pirate except that it's free and easy.

What else can one say? There's no just answer.

agreed

I came in here to post basically what Moriason said. I really have no excuse for internet piracy. I do it because it saves me money. If that's wrong, that's a sin I'm willing to bear. I have no excuse.