Books reading people (Read 819 times)

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no i's you say ?? how does he see what he's typing ??
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no i's you say ?? how does he see what he's typing ??

jsadlfjslkfj post of the year 2010
I love this hobby - stealing your mother's diary
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I do it all the time and I don't think it's ethically a bad thing. I do it simply because it makes it easier to understand people and what/why they do things. Also because my girlfriend is studying psychology and I find what she tells me interesting.
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I work in retail and I try to read every person as well as I can for a few reasons:

a) I have to determine how crazy they are
b) I have to determine what kind of crazy they are

are the biggest, but there are others. Trying to decide how much they are willing to spend is pretty low on that list (surprisingly, for a salesman) because I'd rather seem like a friendly helpful person than be good at selling things to people. Mostly I just have to try to determine as quickly as possible if they are going to have a batshit crazy response to something. Also, riding a busy transit system every day means I have to try and read people based on visual cues so that I can avoid people stabbing me and whatever. It's a serious concern of mine.

If I could read minds yes, I would, but only the minds of strangers who I have no interest in interacting with for more than a few minutes. Anything past that and I'd rather genuinely get to know someone via conversation OR WHATEVER.
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The question of whether it's right to manipulate people with your interpersonal skills is dependent on whether you believe in free choice. If you are a determinist, then the extent to which you affect others isn't a moral question, but a pragmatic one (the end result of which is either geared to you or geared to your concept of utilitarian "good"). It's a little harder to answer if you believe in free choice, because then you have to reconcile yourself with:
A.) Whether your actions can actually impel someone to change
B.) Whether it is right to steer people's actions in a certain direction, even if you allow that the direction they choose is ultimately their own choice
C.) How you believe that direction is the 'right' one.

I'm a determinist, personally.
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I work in retail and I try to read every person as well as I can for a few reasons:

a) I have to determine how crazy they are
b) I have to determine what kind of crazy they are

are the biggest, but there are others. Trying to decide how much they are willing to spend is pretty low on that list (surprisingly, for a salesman) because I'd rather seem like a friendly helpful person than be good at selling things to people. Mostly I just have to try to determine as quickly as possible if they are going to have a batshit crazy response to something. Also, riding a busy transit system every day means I have to try and read people based on visual cues so that I can avoid people stabbing me and whatever. It's a serious concern of mine.

If I could read minds yes, I would, but only the minds of strangers who I have no interest in interacting with for more than a few minutes. Anything past that and I'd rather genuinely get to know someone via conversation OR WHATEVER.
lol is being stabbed on the bus really a "serious concern" for you?
i thought i was paranoid... :welp:
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The question of whether it's right to manipulate people with your interpersonal skills is dependent on whether you believe in free choice. If you are a determinist, then the extent to which you affect others isn't a moral question, but a pragmatic one (the end result of which is either geared to you or geared to your concept of utilitarian "good"). It's a little harder to answer if you believe in free choice, because then you have to reconcile yourself with:
A.) Whether your actions can actually impel someone to change
B.) Whether it is right to steer people's actions in a certain direction, even if you allow that the direction they choose is ultimately their own choice
C.) How you believe that direction is the 'right' one.

I'm a determinist, personally.
...if you were a hard determinist/materialist, ethics would be a completely moot issue because everything that happens is the only thing that could have happened. Therefore your own manipulation of said other was already a predetermined phenomenon set in motion by pre-existing material conditions.
Last Edit: September 21, 2010, 10:09:07 pm by DietCoke
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The question of whether it's right to manipulate people with your interpersonal skills is dependent on whether you believe in free choice. If you are a determinist, then the extent to which you affect others isn't a moral question, but a pragmatic one (the end result of which is either geared to you or geared to your concept of utilitarian "good"). It's a little harder to answer if you believe in free choice, because then you have to reconcile yourself with:
A.) Whether your actions can actually impel someone to change
B.) Whether it is right to steer people's actions in a certain direction, even if you allow that the direction they choose is ultimately their own choice
C.) How you believe that direction is the 'right' one.

I'm a determinist, personally.

it's not magic, the other person has a say. if you were really hungry, and someone offered you a sandwich at their house and you went to their house, has your free will been challenged? i guess it's kinda similar to being able to tell when people are hungry and what they want to eat.
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...if you were a hard determinist/materialist, ethics would be a completely moot issue because everything that happens is the only thing that could have happened. Therefore your own manipulation of said other was already a predetermined phenomenon set in motion by pre-existing material conditions.
You're right here -- this is precisely what I mean when I say the manipulation of others isn't a moral question to the determinist. At which point, the concept of manipulation can be explained by personal motives (pragmatism/utilitarianism).

it's not magic, the other person has a say. if you were really hungry, and someone offered you a sandwich at their house and you went to their house, has your free will been challenged? i guess it's kinda similar to being able to tell when people are hungry and what they want to eat.
You're also right. Free will can't be challenged in retrospect, because it is logically possible for you to have made the choice to stop by your friend's place and have a sammy, as opposed to being impelled to go because you are hungry, you have plenty of gas, and his house has nice lighting, etc.. Any belief in anything is ultimately a matter of faith -- whether it comes to empiricism or determinism or even pragmatism. I readily admit that. At any rate, it's clear that you believe in free will. Ergo, the principle question is whether it is moral to manipulate or influence others. Well, since you believe in free will, it's not like you can ROB someone of free will (because that is a determinist viewpoint). Ergo, it should not be logically possible for you to manipulate anyone anyway. It is possible for you to influence them, but the decision they make after an influence is their own to make.
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lol is being stabbed on the bus really a "serious concern" for you?
i thought i was paranoid... :welp:


Haha, naw, the subway.

I'm not really worried about getting stabbed (that was part wasn't serious) but I am constantly watching for trouble brewing, which it does frequently enough that the energy I spend on it (mild vigilance) is justified. I am less worried about being jumped than I am about somebody near me being harassed. I like to see that shit coming so I can decide if I'll intervene or not. There are also lots of insane people who want to yell at you, so I like to be aware of who they are and avoid them as needed.

when you're riding the rails every day you see some things, man....
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I try to read others minds and I do it pretty .... Well.... I normally don't guess like that. what  I do is look at there action and habits they do gives them away and you can normally get Idea what type life style and what type mind set.  But my 2nd boss at wal-mart I read everything he was going to do. Because I had so many Run-ins with him I knew him from the back of my hand.

Then I pushed out to manipulate him to finally solve this shit or get fired (I really didn't care which both solved my problem regardless because I couldn't just quit and expect unemployment to pay me and if I didn't have a car payment I would of quit awhile ago) I knew at least ever month he tries to make something out nothing.

but it's quite a long story so I won't finish it let's just say that tyrant fired me witch I gave it a 90% chance of happening, 9% of nothing getting solved (which was the worst thing that could happen since I was at the point of misery) and about 1% of him listening to me but he never dose so it was a fat chance in hell that would happen.

What he thinks is I did to retaliate. It was something more then he could ever for see.  PS found a better job.(I knew there was a better job one time I told my boss he is a horrible manager and he goes how many boss did I have  I said there was DC witch I got along with him great for almost year till he left. I also was think there where also 4 or 5 stores I been to fix up the store and I could consider them bosses too in a way but I never said that and he basically scoffed at what I was saying. but I know a another employee that had about 6 or 7 and he said he was the worst he ever seen too so. )
Last Edit: September 22, 2010, 12:29:56 am by DDay
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you're a hard guy to read, DDay
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solution: put your controller in the other port
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you're a hard guy to read, DDay

I think you mean literally on the writing and stance structure but if you knew me in person you would say the same thing.
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solution: put your controller in the other port
if you know what i mean
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Most of the "reading" you're talking about involves a lot of error.  This is the ethical question of reading people.  When you do it, do you realize your own personal bias in your interpretation of their behavior?  Projection works both ways.  When people say things about others, they often project (some people do it more than others).  If you're ever done projective personality testing you'd know what i'm talking about. 

Second, do you always look for negative attributes and fail to interpret the behaviors that could be seen as positive assets?  People do this too much.

Third, does the person remind you of someone else (do a similar behavior as someone else) yet you interpret their behavior in the same way.  People engage in the same behavior for different reasons.

and.. ethics are not the same as morals.
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you can approach it like you would any other science; come up with a hypothesis and test it, looking for information that both proves and (potentially) disproves your 'interpretation'

also i don't know why you felt the need to distinguish ethics and morality.
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Haha, naw, the subway.

I'm not really worried about getting stabbed (that was part wasn't serious) but I am constantly watching for trouble brewing, which it does frequently enough that the energy I spend on it (mild vigilance) is justified. I am less worried about being jumped than I am about somebody near me being harassed. I like to see that shit coming so I can decide if I'll intervene or not. There are also lots of insane people who want to yell at you, so I like to be aware of who they are and avoid them as needed.

when you're riding the rails every day you see some things, man....
for real.
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if you know what i mean
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you can approach it like you would any other science; come up with a hypothesis and test it, looking for information that both proves and (potentially) disproves your 'interpretation'
can you analyze why my cousn always shts n hs drawers