It's simply a big undertaking, similar to moving out of Iraq, that you have to plan out carefully and execute in several stages. You can't just decide on one day that you're going to revolt the country, much like you can't just collectively leave Iraq on one day (no matter how badly Ron Paul would want to).

That's true. Just as you'd said, I figure if it were ever going to happen, it would have to be done in a very gradual manner that would be implemented over time. Something so the general public would easily accept it and hopefully wouldn't notice it. How long would an undertaking like that take, though? As funny as it seems now, our right to have guns is quite a large founding aspect of our country.

My friend was actually AT this church when it happened. Craziness.

Does he still plan to go to the church? I was kinda wondering how members of the church would react. I for one would probably go find a different, smaller church less likely to get shot up after something like this. Did he know anyone who was shot?

Oh, no, how dare they report interviews accurately. Seriously, it's an article on an incident in a church, so what do you expect? Seriously? Take your anti religious shtick elsewhere, it's tiring.

Yes. You are right.

WOW security guards at a fucking church, that has got to be one of the stupidest things I've ever heard of...

And hell, it might just be me but that lady did sound a bit zealotic.


WWJD???

UNLOAD ON SOME JEW

I don't see how having guards on a church would be stupid, but oh well... (And this case clearly proves it isn't)

Additionally, I agree with Drule. Here in Chile atm, the government along with the police and several organizations are making campaigns for people to hand-in their guns.

The sad thing here, to me, is that this is the kind of occurrence that gun nuts will point to, saying that there is a need for them to have weapons.

If everyone has a gun, then everyone can defend against the crazies who also have guns.  Sounds like a pretty valid point to me.

Does he still plan to go to the church? I was kinda wondering how members of the church would react. I for one would probably go find a different, smaller church less likely to get shot up after something like this. Did he know anyone who was shot?

That kind of defeats the purpose of having faith.  If you truly believe in God, then you have nothing to fear and you'll continue going to church.  It's not like crazy hobos attack cathedrals on a daily basis.

WOW security guards at a fucking church, that has got to be one of the stupidest things I've ever heard of...

And yet it saved the lives of probably dozens of people.  Who knows how many rounds that guy had or how hell bent he was on taking people down.

Gamingw, I think you know what must be done.

VOTE RON PAUL
2008

If everyone has a gun, then everyone can defend against the crazies who also have guns.  Sounds like a pretty valid point to me.

or maybe it would just lead to petty arguments turning into gunfights. honestly reasoning like this is dumb as hell.

Instead' date=' people state that they should protect themselves because there's so much gun-related crime. Which is like paying off a loan with a new loan.[/quote']

Here is my stance on gun rights:

Giving everyone a gun is like given them a computer and teaching them how to pirate movies/music/games.

Yeah, it puts everyone on an equal playing feild, and helps them when it comes to the gun carrying "crazies", but we have no idea how many people that are currently moral without guns would turn immoral with a gun. (or more importantly how many people who are currently immoral with a gun would be moral without) It's been proven that the only thing that keeps some people from stealing is the lack of capability without implication (myself included), the same can be said for gun crime. I mean, in a world where EVERYONE has a gun, how afraid would you be of getting arrested? All you would need is more freinds than there are people in the police force.

It's the whole argument for gun control that gun enthusaists just don't understand. There are people who are willing to do gun crime that aren't willing to go to through the trouble of getting one illegally. If you don't see that as a valid point, then you have a pretty narrow view of human psychology (seriously, I first learned this shit in a high-school elective course. It's pretty basic stuff, and I don't see why gun control advocates don't bring it up more often).

Here is my stance on gun rights:

Giving everyone a gun is like given them a computer and teaching them how to pirate movies/music/games.

Except that you cannot use a computer to go around shooting up schools and churches

I don't think preventing EVERYONE from owning guns is right either, but there are some people that just shouldn't have access to them.

Except that you cannot use a computer to go around shooting up schools and churches

we'll see what the new GTA has to say about that ;)

I mean, in a world where EVERYONE has a gun, how afraid would you be of getting arrested? All you would need is more freinds than there are people in the police force.

But what if my friends turned on me?  Guns are like the ultimate check and balance.  If everyone is armed, then you know what they're capable of thus you'll have less inclination of messing with them.  Would you go into a pharmacy intending to rob the place knowing full well without a doubt that the clerk is packing heat?  You might still do it, but your hesitation can work against you.

If everyone had a gun and some ammunition, then not only would every sane and law abiding person have one, but every criminal and psycho would too, so gun related deaths would increase and so would gun crime.

But sane and law abiding persons outnumber the insane by a huge factor.  Eventually you'll just end up weeding out that factor.

or maybe it would just lead to petty arguments turning into gunfights. honestly reasoning like this is dumb as hell.

I have your reasoning right here.  His name is Heckler and Koch 9mm.  We can solve our problems in a back alley and rest assured one of us will be right in the end, yes?

Instead, people state that they should protect themselves because there's so much gun-related crime. Which is like paying off a loan with a new loan.

Except the new loan is only worth a quarter of the previous loan's interest.

I wonder when people will start complaining that they need to have fully automatic machine guns in order to protect themselves more easily!

Would you fuck with me if I had an M16A1 slung over my shoulder?  I mean, you don't threaten a police officer with a rock, do you?

Giving everyone a gun is like given them a computer and teaching them how to pirate movies/music/games.

Computers weren't designed for pirating just like guns weren't designed to murder.  The end result of having a gun makes some people use it for means other than hunting or protection, but the end result of having a computer means that some people use it to steal.  The pencil was designed to write but I sure as hell can jam it in your eye and then claim that pencil's kill.

Look, just vote for the right man (or woman)...  

Of course, the right man (or woman) is Ron Paul.

as far as gun control goes I think we should just place more restrictions on who can own a gun

so more thorough background checks, longer and more difficult process to obtain a permit etc etc (also psychological stability should be a factor.. people with serious personality disorders such as anti-social pd or borderline pd should not own firearms)

oh and yeah I dont know what to think about this.. yeah it sucks that 4 people died but I have some reservations about fundies so yeah I'm trying to ignore their complete backwardsness and intolerance and instead focus on the fact that they are just human beings who died for no reason. It is a struggle for me still.. I dont know why

guns weren't designed to murder

I thought this was the only reason why they were invented in first place, to commit murder from long distances

Damn, Marcus. I thought you were just joking at the beginning You've turned into a Paulestinian

edit: man, you're in the fucking US Navy telling us stories of killing terrorists with bazookas on boats in the Persian Gulf, you've probably visited more Eastern/non-Western countries than anyone on GW, you know the way shit works in the world, you've told us in the past how much you support your own institution, yet you're telling us to vote for the man who wants to remove you immediately from Iraq, f*ck everyone else, and give gun's gun's gun's to all the amazing peoples of the world

wait marcus really supports ron paul?

i thought that was a joke