Recently, the news, internet, and other media outlets have highly publicized the deep water that the US economy is facing. A growing national debt, a failing dollar, and falling stocks are all over the newspapers as everyone worries that the US economy, and even other national economies are in major danger of a recession. Recently, a 'financial aid' package has been proposed by President Bush to help repair the situation, but many foreign markets are skeptical about it. The fact that the stock market is priming itself for a depressingly low opening on Tuesday morning doesn't help matters either.

Global economic crisis 'serious': IMF Chief
Global markets plunge on U.S. recession fears


So, what's your take on all this? As an American citizen, I'm rather worried. I know that my family and I are financially secure enough to not be hit really hard by this, but still, out economy tanking isn't good for any American citizen, and I'm honestly worried about a depression coming. Our national debt is skyrocketing, and while I'm willing to give this package by President Bush a fair chance (free money), I'm still rather fearful of our financial future.

As a non american this is really great news for me, because I tend to order DVDs, CDs etc from there anyways (because it's so much cheaper even with shipping). Kinda sucks I ain't buying much toys anymore because the dollar:pound ratio is really good, and would save me a fortune.

ugh it's annoying as a canadian that our economies are sort of linked, also i just set up a mutual fund like a month ago and americas economy has been raping it, it seems like throwing money into a black hole right now

Does this mean I'll be able to buy cheaper import things from USA?

I mean how can this affect my or anyone else's lives? What are the positive/negatives effects of this so called recession if it happens?

If you think this is not a honest question and are going to post "inri cheetos is a troll LOL" then please ignore this post, pretend it doesn't exist

rexxz he is either a blatant troll or a huge idiot (no one is entirely sure yet) so just ignore him

I guess we can thank President Bush for taking the best economy we've had in decades and reversing it to this in just 8 years. It is literally going to take decades to repair all of the damage Bush has done.

I was pretty sure we've been in a recession for a couple years now????? I don't know, everything has been ridiculously expensive (more expensive than just inflation can explain) due to constantly rising oil prices, college gets more fucking expensive every year, I can't afford a car, etc etc

Only one man can save us.................... his name?????



....



Barack Obama

Only one man can save us.................... his name?????



....



Barack Obama

well, Mike Huckabee supports FairTax and while I don't necessarily want the guy to win the presidency or even the nomination, what is everyone's opinion here about FairTax?  From what I've read, it seems like a good idea.  Are there deeper effects I should be worried about?

well the only way this really affects me is that paying for college will be harder

but since I plan on staying in academia I dont really see there being a huge issue (people will always need to go to college... however grant money will start to run dry and doing research will kinda suck (so I will probably relocate to europe))

well, Mike Huckabee supports FairTax and while I don't necessarily want the guy to win the presidency or even the nomination, what is everyone's opinion here about FairTax?  From what I've read, it seems like a good idea.  Are there deeper effects I should be worried about?

http://www.factcheck.org/taxes/unspinning_the_fairtax.html

basically it's good if you are incredibly rich.

FairTax is a ridiculously shitty idea promoted by conservatives who are adherents of the largely disproven supply-side economics school. It is basically an excuse to hand money to the rich, in the supposed hope that it will trickle down to the masses! However, it's been proven again and again the best way to stimulate the economy is high taxes on the rich and give the savings to the middle class, who by FAR purchase the most per capita.

You can still lower taxes all around and get economic growth but only if you cut out a lot of pork barrel projects, which tend to be wastes anyhow.

except the flat tax is based on the Laffer curve, an outdated and terribly inaccurate model of economics. also the british tried something like a "real" flat tax and they had riots: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_Charge

basically tax the fuck out of the rich imho because if you're still rich after taxes eat a dick.

basically tax the fuck out of the rich imho because if you're still rich after taxes eat a dick.

Uh, except the rich own the corporations and will just increase the cost of items to compensate for increased taxes on them. Normally competition would prevent this but because it would be universally applied to all rich people, and rich people are obviously not stupid since they are generally competent at least in business enough to make the money they have made, so they will likely all come up with this idea at the same time and raise the price of goods, which will increase the cost of living in the middle class. Tax breaking the middle class would likely not compensate them for that increase. Also since the graduated income tax scale still affects the rich more than the poor, the middle class is already suffering even with a lower tax burden. The other issue is that as convoluted as our tax system is right now with these general funds and the like, the odds of extra tax revenue gained from taxing the rich actually reaching the middle class is not likely, and since both major parties are guilty of these financial oversights (though I would say republicans a bit more so only because they are in charge of most of the programs at this point) it is not likely a shift in politics would fix it at this point.

Honestly, I don't know the answer. Bush's idea to cut checks to everyone is a rash policy and COULD have been good had he not already put us into debt and weakened our dollar, however, I still expect it to stave off the possibly oncoming depression a bit longer. It is clear that the tax system needs a reform, though I support FairTax, I am not so sure it is the best idea. The main reason I am in favor of it is because it is drastic. A conversion to FairTax (at least in Huckabee's plans) would constitute a complete rework of the tax system, which we desperately need. Hopefully whoever decides to reform the tax system, which will likely be anyone who gets elected and knows what they are doing (Obama, Edwards, Huckabee, McCain), will also reform the social security system since they are tied together.

My suggestion is shifting the burden of social security onto the businesses over a period of time and after maybe 20 years or so, eliminating the government handling of it altogether by simply passing legislation to force businesses to expand their retirement benefits for the amount they used to pay for employee social security I believe this would make it more effective since the businesses already have the framework and handle it more efficiently than the government. Increased legislation and personnel to observe the correct handling of this by businesses will still cost vastly less and need significantly less staff than the current program requires in government and it will also translate to a direct benefit to citizens who will see their government caring what happens to them more than HEY YOU PAID THIS IN BUT WE SPENT IT SORRY.

In some ways I am happy to see this threat of depression because maybe it will wake some people up (namely republicans who are stagnant in their ideologies ignorantly believing that the US is already in great shape) and obviously I want to see the party I belong to actually care about people instead of businesses, though I still believe that the citizens are made better off by strong economy and business.

the following sentences are wrong:

Uh, except the rich own the corporations and will just increase the cost of items to compensate for increased taxes on them.

rich people are obviously not stupid since they are generally competent at least in business enough to make the money they have made, so they will likely all come up with this idea at the same time and raise the price of goods, which will increase the cost of living in the middle class

since the graduated income tax scale still affects the rich more than the poor

Hopefully whoever decides to reform the tax system, which will likely be anyone who gets elected and knows what they are doing (Obama, Edwards, Huckabee, McCain)

businesses already have the framework and handle it more efficiently than the government.

In some ways I am happy to see this threat of depression because maybe it will wake some people up (namely republicans who are stagnant in their ideologies ignorantly believing that the US is already in great shape)

jeff do i really need to elaborate on these

Uh, except the rich own the corporations and will just increase the cost of items to compensate for increased taxes on them.

Ok, so I know absolutely nothing about economics, but this struck me as odd. If the corporations just increased the cost of items wouldn't people just stop buying them in favour of cheaper alternatives which would inevitably rise out of demand? Correct me if I'm wrong! Again, I know NOTHING.

jeff do i really need to elaborate on these

Well if you are just going to be like that, go right ahead. I won't respond now anyway if you can't be civil. YOU ARE WRONG (insert no reasons) HOW DARE YOU STATE YOUR OPINION. Yeah sorry I don't do those kinds of conversations, thanks. Kinds of posts like the one you made have nothing to do with intelligent conversation, all they are doing is capitalizing on the fact that most of GW is left wing to attack anything I say by virtue of popular opinion. So if you are faulting me with the fact GW is left wing, then I ADMIT, IT IS ALL MY FAULT, but I am not going to continue conversations along those lines.

Ok, so I know absolutely nothing about economics, but this struck me as odd. If the corporations just increased the cost of items wouldn't people just stop buying them in favour of cheaper alternatives which would inevitably rise out of demand? Correct me if I'm wrong! Again, I know NOTHING.

nope, you are 100% correct. if the consumer's goods that are not NECESSARY (ie, food) raise in price, consumers will not buy them, and this will harm the corporations.

therefore they are not going to raise taxes because they will lose more money.

Well if you are just going to be like that, go right ahead. I won't respond now anyway if you can't be civil. YOU ARE WRONG (insert no reasons) HOW DARE YOU STATE YOUR OPINION. Yeah sorry I don't do those kinds of conversations, thanks.

well since you refused to debate me, I felt I should point out parts of your argument that were seriously flawed and watch the rest of GW debate you.

edit: and I don't mean some Steel bandwagonning puppetmaster shit, what you typed is seriously seriously flawed.