Footballers.

Google is such hard work I find.

I like _____ because he is a badass and fights with a cool ______.

Characterization? Why on Earth would I want to see that?

Ironically, since I bet a lot of people would recall Scar as a pretty interesting villain, it's this line alone that makes you seem like you 'should shut up now'.

Lion King is one of my favourite movies, and I think Scar deep inside is a very just and noble character, but his will to make his vision come true and the actions that follows his extreme determination to his cause makes him seem more evil than he deserves. Scar is interested in having an equal society (between Lions and Hyenas anyhow) where they share the prosperity that exist in the Pride Lands (seeing as there clearly are enough resources for hyenas to live the lion way of life in peace). He's overthrown as a leader because his society fails as a result of events beyond his control, caused by a drought that lasted long enough for there to be a massive drop in the availability of prey.

I also think that Mustafa's society is one of oppression and kinship rule. While he is a charismatic leader and treats his nobles (the lions) with great respect he refuses any attempt for the hyenas to live a life of dignity, chasing them off violently if they even attempt entering the Pride Lands.

I don't think Scar is nearly as noble as you're making him sound.  I think it helps that I got bored one day and read some of the children's books of the Lion King online, but Scar wasn't really trying to bring the hyenas and lions together, he was just using the hyenas as a means of getting into power.  The reason for this is that when Scar was very young, Simba was always favored by his father.  He met the hyenas when he was feeling very rejected by his father and they sort of fueled him towards wanting to be the new king.  Basically because of his warped childhood, this is the only reason he wants to get into power:  he feels like it will redeem him in his father's eyes.  Of course, his father died before any of this happened, but by that point it was already set in his mind that his only goal in life was to become king.  Though the hyenas had power over him at first, once he grew to be a big strong lion it was pretty easy for him to be the one ruling them.  Scar is still one of those villains where you understand what drove him to be a villain, but I don't agree with the angle you took on that.  He wasn't interested in unity between hyenas and lions, he was interested in making his dead daddy proud (or at least getting back at the brother who got all the attention) and simply had an army of hyenas to keep Mufasa's pride in check.

Also I have no idea what your problem is with Mufasa keeping the hyenas out of the Pridelands is.  The hyenas are NOT noble characters by any means, and letting them in would be trouble.  The hyenas never made an effort to live a life of dignity, I don't see why you think Mufasa was keeping them from doing so.  In fact, this is one of the only things about this film that is true to nature:  hyenas and lions don't get along.  They kill each other's babies all the time, it really is like they're at war.  Explain to me why you'd give them a chance.

edit: Yeah I can't really understand how you (RPGer) could forget the drought either...I mean, you're saying it's because the circle of life was messed up but that CAUSED a drought, that doesn't mean there wasn't one.

Scar was a terrible ruler of the Pride Lands, with, or without the drought, watch the movie again. He had terrible leadership and killed off all the food.

edit: Yeah I can't really understand how you (RPGer) could forget the drought either...I mean, you're saying it's because the circle of life was messed up but that CAUSED a drought, that doesn't mean there wasn't one.

Yeah, the whole idea of the lack of food is Scar not adhering to the rules of survival in the dry season!

Man you are looking way too deep into this

Not that I fault you or anything, but I just sort of took what was given, you know?

hamburgler/motivation struggle: needs hamburgers and mcnuggets

Personally I've always had a soft spot for Stalin

Easy. The germans in Beerfest (greatest movie of ALL time). I mean.. just check this shit:


There's nothing more evil than this.

childrens books of the lion king online, eh?

this is not canon!!

Only the lion king movie is canon!!!!

so yeah while you may be right about him trying to live up to his desire to shine in his fathers pride or whatever postmortem, i dont buy it since that angle isn't introduced at all in the movie and idk those children book sounds like spinoffs for WELCOME TO DISNEY INTERNET and i have a hard time accepting that as canon

The books were meant to reveal more information about the movie, it seems like most people accept at least a few of the stories (particularly the one I'm referencing) as canon.  Also I don't know if I didn't clarify this or whatever but I read them online because they were made when the movie came out so actually finding copies is really hard, they're legit books I was just reading the scans of them.

and yeah Scar isn't a good guy. I'm just sayin his motives are. His mindset is pretty much defined by 'the end justifies the means', meaning he would do anything (killing his brother, the king, and having his nephew, the crown-prince, take the blame) do get into power. i do believe scar's society is way more just than the authoritarian regime of mufasa. i do believe the failure of his society in part had to do with the tensions between lions and hyenas (lions had an ugly pride while hyenas are vulgar) and in part with what happened outside his control. if there hadn't been a drought and there would've been plenty of resources for both the lions and the hyenas his society would be far superior to mufasas.

The failure of his society had to do with him being a shit ruler, end of story.  He doesn't know anything about ruling by any means, it was his fault the hyenas were there to cause the tension--you can tell by the way they are lined up when he meets with Sarabi (Simba's mom) that they are just there to keep Scar safe, because as he says at the beginning he severely lacks strength...they were just there to protect him and nothing else.  I know he gives a big "lions and hyena side by side" speech, but it's just to mask the fact that they're simply his army, he doesn't care about them and isn't trying at all to unify anyone.

What happened to the Pridelands IS his fault, entirely.  The drought is because of his actions with not being able to manage resources.  It's not like a drought just happened to come along out of nowhere, it was because of Scar's actions.  Why do you think it suddenly just rains when Simba comes back?  It's metaphorical, not really realistic, the drought wasn't because of weather so much as it was evil.  He forced the lionesses to overhunt despite them knowing better, because he has no idea how to lead.  He had a childish obsession with wanting to be the king which turned into a crazy obsession, and he never really considered what it would mean.  I mean, his view of being the king is exactly like Simba's as a child.  He constantly says things like "I am the king, I can do whatever I want".  Even when Sarabi tells him it's over, he just forces them to keep hunting.

maybe i just view the hyenas as an oppressed group, with their negative sides being a direct consequence of the extreme oppression they are met with in the pride lands. MAYBE IM JUST AN IDEALIST HUH???

The only one oppressing the hyenas is Scar, so I don't see what you're trying to do here.  They lived in the Shadowlands, and they sneak away to eat the leftovers of the lion's kills.  This is pretty much exactly what hyenas do in real life.  Scar was the one that was pushing them into the Pridelands, if anything he was CAUSING their problems.

I feel really weird getting this much into the Lion King, but it has been and always will be my favorite Disney movie.  I just got both of the movies for my birthday last year on DVD (I don't count 1 1/2 as much of anything it was pretty shit, I mean people debate whether or not the second one was good but I don't see how 1 1/2 could ever be considered good), and since I've been rewatching them I guess I've just thought about it a lot.

Also while we're on the subject of Scar I just want to point out there's a really creepy/good song in the musical where Nala is trying to convince Scar how bad things are and all he does is think "oh man I could have so many babies from her".  It also points out a lot of the stuff I was talking about:

Nobody loved me, there's the rub, not even as a cub
What did my brother have that I don't have?

Let's see...

Joker (in B:tDK): I never read the comics... I never really liked him. But in the movie he was perfect. Not only because of Heath's performance, but because of his intelligence. Loved it.

Regina George (Mean Girls): Someone without any special powers that still manages to be a big threat to other people (in the movie's context), and even though everybody knows she's mean, everybody loves her. I like the whole concept.

Strange... I can't think of any others.

1. Ernest Blofeld (007 novels) - his evil schemes were always so perfect. I loved how he managed to turn something so simple into something so evil.

2. Liquid Ocelot (Metal Gear Solid series) - His twisted fight against the system had merit and terror mingled. The spoilers would come aplenty if I explained why I liked his twisted story.

3. Venom (Spider-Man comics) - When I was a kid, that was my fave character, because he was this insanely powerful underdog to Spidey. His crazy brain hunger made him all the scarier and demented.

4. Nobounaga-oda (Onimusha 1-3) - while Nobounaga was pretty standard "I'm gonna rule the world with demons" villain, the more you learned about him bicariously through other demons was either intreguing or hilarious.

5. The Joker (Dark Knight) - Might as well throw him on here, because this movie really showed off the 'common thug' as a scheming criminal mastermind.