QA - Question Salt World Q&A (Read 8019 times)

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I suppose its mildly ironic that I propose restraint when I literally spelled out that I lacked it for my last post.
 
I don't think there is a situation where I'd say "fucking behave yourself'. At least, its unlikely because as I wrote it I'd realize that it was a reaction less likely to bring about a desired result (honestly we are only lucky that it did anyway). Which I actually think is a huge benefit of text based communication. You can stop yourself and analyze and think "Is this really how I want to convey my thoughts?".
 
Maybe I do put people on a overly intense civility standard. IDK. ESPECIALLY, when the person in question takes the moral/ethical high ground I think you should be the type that carefully words your posts. I'm not a fan of the righteous loud preacher.
 
 
Also, I reiterate: GREEN, GREEN IS BEST FOOLS.
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I don't think there is a situation where I'd say "fucking behave yourself'. At least, its unlikely because as I wrote it I'd realize that it was a reaction less likely to bring about a desired result (honestly we are only lucky that it did anyway).
With respect, I don't think you understand entirely what I'm trying to say. I don't think it's particularly helpful to say something like "fucking behave yourself". It might make someone step back and consider the possibility that they said something wrong, but not likely. Most people don't do that sort of thing. That's true, and I don't dispute that.
What I'm trying to say, however, is it's an understandable reaction to being reminded of the fact that you're a second class citizen.

You keep talking about how Geodude's reaction was that of someone "taking the moral/ethical high ground", like a "righteous loud preacher". That's just nonsense. It's someone reacting to being very deeply personally offended. When you offend people, they can get angry. I don't ever like it when people get angry, but if there was ever a justifiable anger, it's towards someone hurling homophobic slurs like they're nothing.

When something like this happens, and your only reaction is to denounce the victim getting angry, you don't understand what bigotry is and how powerful it can be.
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Think everyone else pretty much covered what I had to say (Esiann etc). But I do find being called or hinted at as a homophobe extremely offensive. I know Dada said he doesn't actually believe I am one, but still thought I would say that because I've been called one in another similar conversation too. Not a lot on the internet offends me! But for some reason that does. Same with if someone called me a racist because both are blatantly incorrect . 
 
Edit: I always thought lime green and dark purple were cool when I was a kid. 
Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 09:26:31 pm by Afura
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all your'e color choices suck. you're all a bunch of stinker.s
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But I do find being called or hinted at as a homophobe extremely offensive. I know Dada said he doesn't actually believe I am one, but still thought I would say that because I've been called one in another similar conversation too. Not a lot on the internet offends me! But for some reason that does. Same with if someone called me a racist because both are blatantly incorrect.
no
 
you don't get to appropriate this discourse when someone criticises your behaviour towards a marginalised person. not now, not ever
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Sometimes I truly believe you are over-sensitive and I've said that before. I'm not trying to "appropriate the discourse" and I have no ulterior motives. I just made a one off comment and that is all. They have every right to criticise my behavior if they feel the need (I never denied that.) But that doesn't mean they can jump into making assumptions about my character and call me a homophobe. 
Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 09:34:53 pm by Afura
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Clearly I don't know everything about marginalized groups because I come from a place of more privilege  I am aware of that. All I'm saying is don't assume that I hate gay people either because that is untrue. 
Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 09:36:26 pm by Afura
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This is not necessarily related to what you guys are saying, but its pretty harsh to go around throwing terms calling individuals homophobes/racist/etc.  in the same sense that throwing a slur is if it is something that really cannot be fairly extrapolated from that individual's behavior or context.   I think any of us would be hurt if they were accused of something like that if it were not true (eg if you're actually a homophobe you suck)
 
 
edit  I reread my statement so let me make it more clear.   Slurs are not okay ever.  Calling someone out falsey is not okay without justification that is more than just 'possibly extrapolated' from means that really cannot be backed up. and also, like i said earlier, this  is really not directed toward anybody, and is just being made as genearlized ALL OUT THERE kinda statement
Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 09:39:01 pm by ATARI
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Think everyone else pretty much covered what I had to say (Esiann etc). But I do find being called or hinted at as a homophobe extremely offensive. I know Dada said he doesn't actually believe I am one, but still thought I would say that because I've been called one in another similar conversation too. Not a lot on the internet offends me! But for some reason that does. Same with if someone called me a racist because both are blatantly incorrect . 
No, I don't think you are. That bit about "maybe you think the gays are getting too uppity" was mostly just meant to be a joke. I do think it was insensitive of you to say what you did, though. The reason why I got mad is because I think in these situations the best thing to do is just accept whatever the wronged party said and not complain too much about it. This is just how people, like in this case Geodude, can react when they see these deeply insulting things. But I'm sorry, I shouldn't have reacted the way I did. You're right.

I just really wish that when things like this happen, people don't first look at the victim's reaction, but at the perpetrator's act. That should always come first. And it's not right to call people overly sensitive either. That's just not helpful. Of course people are sensitive to things that are as personal and offensive as this. And everybody's different, not everyone's able to cope with it as well as others.

This is not necessarily related to what you guys are saying, but its pretty harsh to go around throwing terms calling individuals homophobes/racist/etc.
I've never said this to anyone without a good cause for doing so. And if you have a good reason, then it's good to call people out.
Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 09:40:41 pm by dada
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Some of us have some pretty deep psychological scars re: sexuality/internalized homophobia so I think it's totally fair for us to be "overly sensitive" about it.
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when you leave this topic, when you close the tab, the issue leaves your life for as long as you want it to. i have no such privilege. we have no such privilege
Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 09:41:09 pm by tuxedo marx
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Think everyone else pretty much covered what I had to say (Esiann etc). But I do find being called or hinted at as a homophobe extremely offensive. I know Dada said he doesn't actually believe I am one, but still thought I would say that because I've been called one in another similar conversation too. Not a lot on the internet offends me! But for some reason that does. Same with if someone called me a racist because both are blatantly incorrect . 
No, I don't think you are. That bit about "maybe you think the gays are getting too uppity" was mostly just meant to be a joke. I do think it was insensitive of you to say what you did, though. The reason why I got mad is because I think in these situations the best thing to do is just accept whatever the wronged party said and not complain too much about it. This is just how people, like in this case Geodude, can react when they see these deeply insulting things. But I'm sorry, I shouldn't have reacted the way I did. You're right.

I just really wish that when things like this happen, people don't first look at the victim's reaction, but at the perpetrator's act. That should always come first. And it's not right to call people overly sensitive either. That's just not helpful. Of course people are sensitive to things that are as personal and offensive as this. And everybody's different, not everyone's able to cope with it as well as others.
 
I understand where you are coming from. Even that calling someone over-sensitive isn't particularly helpful so I apologize for that. 
Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 09:45:46 pm by Afura
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Quote
I've never said this to anyone without a good cause for doing so. And if you have a good reason, then it's good to call people out.
 
agreed. i didn't really read carefully back through the old posts but i don't really care.  i'm just saying this in genreal, no to, for, or because of anyone or what was said.  don't give a fuck.
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Geodude, are you homosexual? If so, then maybe I can sort of understand your response better.
 
Bizarrely, I always thought you were a straight male. How very 'heteronormative' of me :P
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Yep, that is (a small facet of) the definition of heteronormativity.
Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 10:00:47 pm by esiann
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Q. have you ever been bitten in the ass by an assumption about someone regarding sexuality/race/etc (even if you don't consider yourself bigoted and it really was an honest mistake?)?
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Good question. 
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Geodude, are you homosexual? If so, then maybe I can sort of understand your response better.
I must have pointed out that he's personally affected by this about 5 times now. He's pretty open on IRC but I don't know if he's ever mentioned it directly on the forums, aside from all the indirect mentions in this topic.

edit
Q. have you ever been bitten in the ass by an assumption about someone regarding sexuality/race/etc (even if you don't consider yourself bigoted and it really was an honest mistake?)?
Yes I have! I figure most people have probably have, if they've been online for a long time.
Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 09:55:43 pm by dada
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i've been attracted to people of different identities and it's not something i see as a barrier to attraction, in my case. i use the word "queer" to describe myself partly out of reclamation but mostly because it's the only word i see fit to describe it

consider this an unequivocal confirmation of my sexuality
Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 09:53:39 pm by tuxedo marx